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hn_throwaway_99 · 2 months ago
I don't like "submarine" PR articles like this, because I feel like the author didn't ask any of the obvious questions around this zipper:

1. No closeup pics of how the zipper is actually sewed onto fabrics.

2. Is this design more likely to tear fabrics than a traditional zipper? A video another commenter linked made it look more fragile to me, but I don't know.

3. The biggest issue with any zipper is snags. This design looks like it would be a lot more likely to snag, but maybe not.

4. As other commenters mentioned, can it be repaired without special equipment?

I'm not saying this design is good or bad, just that this puff piece article didn't ask any of the immediate questions I had.

whycome · 2 months ago
Agreed

> Its dominance comes from an unusual level of control: YKK manufactures its own machines, designs its own molds, and even spins its own thread. That self-sufficiency lets it experiment in ways competitors can’t, turning a mundane component into a field for continuous innovation.

I thought the point was that there hasn’t been any innovation??

hilbert42 · 2 months ago
"The biggest issue with any zipper is snags. This design looks like it would be a lot more likely to snag, but maybe not."

I can't see this new design solving that problem. Of all the day-to-day inanimate objects I've encountered I'd single out zippers as the most problematic I've come across. I cannot think of another device I've had so much trouble with.

They snag, jam, the teeth fall out or tear out with little provocation, they come 'unraveled' at the ends and cannot be easily fixed. Fly zippers have even caused me injury, and when used on sleeping bags and like they catch the fabric and either damage it or break in the process of untangling them. And if that's not enough, the metal parts of zippers corrode in washing detergents and stain removers—often to the extent that it's a significant cause of zipper failures.

Moreover, zippers are much more difficult to replace than buttons—I can replace a button on a shirt or fly in a minute or two but replacing a zipper is a major undertaking especially if one is not expert with a sewing machine.

Zippers on jackets are often the worst, I've an ex NATO military jacket that's tough and hard wearing and extremely well made that I'd never be without in winter but its YKK zipper gives me no end of trouble. And recently I've scrapped two perfectly good high-visibility jackets because zipper teeth have pulled out and in both instances the zippers weren't subject to abuse (these zippers weren't YKK brand).

Give me buttons any day.

PS: my other peeve is Velcro on clothing. I dare not mention the tortures that ought to be inflicted on the person who came up with that abomination of an idea.

f30e3dfed1c9 · 2 months ago
You seem to have... very unusual experience with zippers. I honestly can't remember the last time I had trouble with one or ever having any serious trouble with one.
m463 · 2 months ago
I think most zipper trouble I've had is with zippers that are too small for the job.

I think really fat YKK style zippers on things like boots or gloves are wonderful.

The zippers I've had problems with are usually small-tooth non-ykk zippers.

nikole9696 · 2 months ago
I don't have much trouble with zippers, but I had a jacket where it broke. I had a tailor put on a new one.

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snowwrestler · 2 months ago
Nitpicking here, but this is not a submarine article. This is above the waves, straight-ahead, overt PR.

It’s a standard product launch article. The news is: Company Announced Product. The article is: what the company says about the product. There’s not much more to report than that, yet. Once the product actually hits shelves there can be more articles with real world tests, breakdowns, close-ups, etc.

The reality is that YKK does not actually know if the new zipper will cause more tears, snag easier, be harder to repair, etc. No one will know until the product actually comes into extended contact with the real world.

IAmBroom · 2 months ago
I'd say that testing of the product's performance in the lab is possible, but agree that WE the consumers won't know the truth until we experience it.
more_corn · 2 months ago
The biggest issue with zippers is durability. I’ve had dozens of broken zippers over my lifetime on clothing that was far from end of life. If I could pay $20 extra dollars for a piece of clothing with a twice as durable zipper I’d do it. I’m pretty sure zippers cost a dime so that’s a good margin.
hilbert42 · 2 months ago
"If I could pay $20 extra dollars for a piece of clothing with a twice as durable zipper I’d do it."

Agreed, the biggest issue is durability, like you I've had many broken zippers which often seem to break at the most inconvenient time, embarrassing experiences such as having to secure my fly with bent paperclips pushed through the fabric come to mind.

But I think there's more to it than just durability as there are some basic design issues that are hard to overcome. For instance, if a tooth gets pulled out or it does not mesh properly with its opposite mate then all will unravel (and that happens surprising often). It only takes one missing tooth or the first teeth to be not properly anchored for the whole zipper to fail. Cascading failures don't happen with buttons (one missing isn't much of a problem).

edgineer · 2 months ago
You can buy a new zipper and have a tailor put it on for you. I've upgraded clothing in this way before. Total cost is about $20.
emptybits · 2 months ago
"Major Upgrade" for the fast, disposable fashion crowd.

Major downgrade for maintainability and ability to repair.

This "upgraded" zipper will be impossible to replace if broken at home, by hand or with a machine, or even at a typical professional repair shop. YKK documents say a "dedicated AiryString® sewing machine" is required.[1]

[1]https://ykkdigitalshowroom.com/assets/AiryString_202507_en.p...

OptionOfT · 2 months ago
Fabrics have gotten a lot thinner, and thus develop holes a lot more quickly.

I have t-shirts from 2010 which are faded but have 0 holes. Whereas t-shirts I bought half a year ago have holes in them.

Also, you mentioning the inability to repair stuff at home makes me sad. My mom, 72 year old, repaired my nephew's jacket the other day. Brand new zipper.

The machine in that PDF you shared makes me feel YKK is going in the direction of Apple. They supply the parts and the manufacturing device.

You do something they don't like? Sewing machine turns off.

emptybits · 2 months ago
Yes. Also at the above link:

"All AiryString® part sales and leasing of dedicated sewing machines are conducted between YKK and the customer. YKK will also coordinate the installation and startup of sewing machines at garment manufacturing factories. For more information on leasing dedicated sewing machines, please contact your YKK representative"

testdelacc1 · 2 months ago
> I have t-shirts from 2010 which are faded but have 0 holes. Whereas t-shirts I bought half a year ago have holes in them.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b2/Survivor...

rootusrootus · 2 months ago
> I have t-shirts from 2010 which are faded but have 0 holes. Whereas t-shirts I bought half a year ago have holes in them.

One of the little things I find most satisfying about getting old is hearing the same proclamations about quality going to shit today that I heard when I was much younger, only now the supposedly-good baseline of the comparison happened well after the complaints I grew up hearing. I, too, want everyone to get the hell off my lawn.

portaouflop · 2 months ago
The fix is easy: Don’t buy new clothes from fast fashion brands or stores.

If you only buy quality from small stores and independent designers you still get the same quality you got 15 years ago. Sure it’s 2-3 times the price but it’s worth it.

constantcrying · 2 months ago
>Major downgrade for maintainability and ability to repair.

But it seems the exact opposite is true. These zippers should be easily removable, leaving the fabric mostly intact. After that you can put in a normal zipper.

pavon · 2 months ago
This looks much harder to seam-rip to me, as the stitching is going between the individual zipper teeth.
snowwrestler · 2 months ago
It remains to be seen if it can be repaired by hand. A special sewing machine is required, as opposed to using a regular sewing machine. The document you linked is about garment production, not repair.

How things get repaired is not up to the original company in most cases. People are inventive when they need to be.

Almost anything that can be sewn together by a machine can be sewn together by hand too. That said, sewing doesn’t do much for most zipper failures anyway, which are usually broken teeth or sliders.

Retr0id · 2 months ago
It might be more challenging but I don't see why you couldn't also sew this by hand.
Aloisius · 2 months ago
> This "upgraded" zipper will be impossible to replace if broken at home, by hand or with a machine

It looks like they just replaced the tape with cord. I see no reason why you wouldn't be able to hand stitch it in, though it might need some temporary stitches to hold it in place.

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thadk · 2 months ago
Huh, reading the spec sheet, the hem line at the bottom of these has to be quite thin like the rest of the zipper-proximate area.

You can note on each of the 3 example garments and in the comment near them that the double thick sewn hem has to end near the new "zipper" design.

Dead Comment

behnamoh · 2 months ago
> That incremental progress mirrors YKK’s founding philosophy, the “Cycle of Goodness.” The principle—that no one prospers without benefiting others—has supposedly guided the company for decades. It’s visible in its other micro-improvements: corrosion-resistant alloys, sound-dampened sliders, recyclable polyester tapes. AiryString continues that tradition, shrinking the zipper’s physical and environmental footprint at once.

This is alien to SF AI startups and patent trolls.

edelbitter · 2 months ago
Having your customers suddenly require proprietary machinery (only sold/licensed by you) to unlock the full potential of your upgraded product line.. does seem compatible with the SF startup way of thinking.
beloch · 2 months ago
It will be interesting to see what they do next.

The SF approach would be to lock down every aspect of the new zippers with as much proprietary BS as possible for as long as possible, charging high fees the whole time and quite likely causing relatively poor market penetration. Relatively few people will pay $50 extra for a thinner zipper on a typical jacket. To combat this, one SF approach might be to pump out ads and branding to to make the new zipper a status symbol.

e.g. Will we start to see fashion designers paid to highlight the new zippers on their products rather than hiding them behind flaps or in folds? Are Brando biker jackets about to trend again?

On the other hand, YKK might simply do what they've been doing for the last century: Obliterate the competition by doing what they do better and cheaper. This is how they took the market from manufacturer's like Talon. They might maintain control of their new zipper tech with patents, etc., but they might also make the tooling affordable and try to maximize uptake by manufacturers.

I have a vintage reproduction of a 1920's cafe racer with a Talon zipper on it. That thing needs to be babied. Zip it up wrong and the slide will bend, teeth will stop engaging, etc.. If you want a jacket that you'll think twice about zipping up (e.g. "Am I really so cold it's worth it?"), get something with a vintage Talon zipper. The first thing that stood out to me as a falsehood in this article was the claim that this is the first upgrade to the zipper in a century. YKK has been quietly making them better and better that whole time.

dingnuts · 2 months ago
yes, and the fact that the article brushes over this and is so breathless -- it's an ad, right?

My first question was: if they remove the tape, how do you affix it to the garment? and you're right, the article glides over the fact that this company, which is largely a monopoly, is creating garments that will apparently require a proprietary device to repair.

It's like a Juicero ad, but for your fly. I'm good.

hulitu · 2 months ago
They surely learned something from Microsoft.

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ardit33 · 2 months ago
not a productive comment. The web is made and run by myriad of frameworks, that were developed open source by startups, or folks that worked in tech that wanted to improve things bit by bit and wanted to share to the community.

Tech in general is the much more open industry compared to any other (cars, biotech, etc), and it is uniquely where closed sourced frameworks have a har time to succeed.

kakacik · 2 months ago
None of them will be around for long, and if yes only by pure unintended accident.

But dont blame the participants, they fight for money in system setup for them. If people will reward clearly more moral businesses, over time even the most hardened sociopath will pick up the cues.

If you want to hate something, hate how uncaring an average person is, driven by simple, easy to manipulate emotions, not fighting primal urges even if they drive them off the cliff, or even caring more deeply about themselves, who they are and where they go.

XenophileJKO · 2 months ago
Isn't it kind of the opposite? Taking a ethical stance is often superficially suboptimal at maximizing personal value. Obviously moral frameworks vary by culture, but commonly involve setting aside some amount of self interest.

The same is true of a business, primarily driven by the executives and carried out by rank and file.

Amorymeltzer · 2 months ago
The excellent Avery Trufelman (formerly of 99% Invisible) has been running Articles of Interest (<https://www.articlesofinterest.co> and <https://articlesofinterest.substack.com>), a surprisingly interesting podcast about clothing and and culture and so much more. The Ivy League episodes are a great example of what they're about.

Over the summer, they had an episode about the zipper—<https://articlesofinterest.substack.com/p/new-episode-zipper...> and <https://www.articlesofinterest.co/podcast/episode/2b1f2292/z...>—which is well worth a listen.

chrchr · 2 months ago
Anyone interested in zippers, or, more significantly for this website, how new technologies are invented, adopted, and mature, should read "Zipper: An Exploration in Novelty" by Robert D. Friedel [1]

YKK is kind of one of the heroes of the story. The zipper was pioneered by the U.S. company Talon Fastener, which was acquired and parted out in the 1970s. YKK bought the legacy machining for manufacturing zippers and went on to dominate the global market.

[1] https://www.amazon.com/Zipper-Exploration-Robert-D-Friedel/d...

Danieru · 2 months ago
This is a big deal for YKK.

Until a few years ago they had a hold on the upper end of the market. The chinese competitor's quality was unreliable enough that clothing manufacturers were willing to pay a premium to ensure a failed zipper does not trash a garment. That situation has been changing, and chinese companies are offering zippers which are getting used on progressively higher end products.

By releasing a new product with substantial changes and thus patentability they can buy a few decades at the top of the market. I suspect this technology has been in development for a long time, and held back until competitors were threatening the premium traditional zipper market.

harimau777 · 2 months ago
YKK still has the advantage in that they are known for quality. I use YKK in my sewing because I can count on them being good. On the other hand, I don't know which Chinese manufactuers are reliable.
dingnuts · 2 months ago
why would China respect a Japanese patent?
Marsymars · 2 months ago
They may not, but you can't really sell patent-violating products at scale in patent-respecting countries without opening yourself up to lawsuits.
Our_Benefactors · 2 months ago
They won’t, but clothing manufacturers will or they’ll be subject to Japanese lawsuits.

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mmooss · 2 months ago
They want Japan to respect Chinese patents, and they want to benefit from trade with Japan.
thunderbong · 2 months ago
olejorgenb · 2 months ago
Published 4 years ago, yet it show this new product unless I'm mistaken.
olejorgenb · 2 months ago
> Early adopters are already experimenting. Descente Japan, known for technical sportswear, was among the first to prototype AiryString in 2022
mgnienie · 2 months ago
There is another one from two years ago with more details: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1JN9kR3EZw
neom · 2 months ago
"Please be aware that when using AiryString® on fabrics with the following characteristics, there are concerns that the zipper may come unstitched, roll into the slider, or not be strong enough. ◇ Fabrics with notably low slippage resistance ( woven fabrics: fabrics with low thread counts, knitted fabrics: fabrics with loose tension). ◇ Fabrics with low friction resistance ◇ Fabrics with large bumps ◇ Shaggy fabrics"

Seems like the target use case is Athleisure?

jsolson · 2 months ago
That would make sense.

My first thought was "Arc'teryx will probably adopt this immediately." They (and similar brands) are already pushing as hard as they can on seamlessness or very very tight seams.

harimau777 · 2 months ago
Doesn't Arc'teryx make outdoor gear? That's something where I absolutely would not buy a product that I couldn't repair in the field with a needle and thread.