Consumer-facing routing is a commodity these days. Apple and Google's bundled maps/routing products get better by the month and are sweeping all before them. The only exit strategies for Citymapper that I could ever see were "get acquired by Apple/Google" or "firesale", and although the latter might be a bit harsh, TechCrunch suggests investors weren't exactly laughing all the way to the bank.[1]
If you can identify a niche and keep your costs down then you might have a chance. Apps targeted at enthusiast cyclists continue to do well, for example, although I have my doubts about expenditure vs revenue for some of them. (Disclaimer: I run a small-scale cycle routing app/site.)
But "people who want to get around Western European and North American cities" is not a niche that Apple/Google were ever going to overlook.
This is too bad because Citymapper is a great app and Google Maps is still very far from providing the same quality as specialized apps for public transit routing.
The one advantage these specialised apps can have is their hyper-specific transit suggestions, which are custom per city. For example, in London Citymapper will suggest to wait and board front/mid/back of the platform to align yourself better with exits at your destination.
Apple and Google tend to be slower to add suggestions like this because they scale poorly to other cities. But it's only a matter of time before they add them.
> For example, in London Citymapper will suggest to wait and board front/mid/back
This never seems as useful as it should be because I'm missing a reliable way to know which direction a London Underground train will approach from?
There is a red stop light, but many stations have these at both ends of the platform. Is there some signage or other piece of infrastructure that gives it away?
Issues with Google (I'm not familiar with Apple maps) maps are the cost and inflexibility. It can't do routing for non standard vehicles taking into account height limits, same side routing, hazmat etc
I've always loved Citymapper, it made using public transport when living in a new city a breeze. It's really sad they don't support my current city, I'd be willing to put in free work to make it happen but I've never seen any way of helping out.
Just chiming in with another option. May have been cause they are Montreal based, but back when I still lived there and regularly used public transport, Transit[1] was my favorite.
Transit's UI is superior to any other comparable app, but I find CityMapper's routes superior (at least in NYC).
I've also had issues with Transit surfacing incorrect bus routes based on cancelled buses (but scheduled) which CityMapper somehow could account for. Transit knows the next scheduled bus two minutes away isn't "live" (icons are different) but still surfaces it as a primary suggestion, while Citymapper wouldn't.
+1 for transit. (I’m also predictably from Montréal haha)
The crowning feature of Transit is the GO trips that let you share you location while on a bus with others. For bus arrival accuracy there’s nothing better. It’s probably saved me a flight or two before, by just making sure I get the 747 bus to the airport.
i use transit in LA (where it's the default app for metro) and it has a huge glaring UX failure in that the departure times list at the bottom of the line details screen takes up at least a 1/3 of the screen, and when you want to see more of the map and try to push the list down, it closes the details screen. it's so frustrating, because i end up doing this 2-3 times per use, needlessly tapping back and forth. there's already a close button available so scroll to bottom to dismiss is wholly unnecessary. the departure times list wastes a ton of precious screen real estate as well - it could simply be a comma-delimited list on one line that could scroll sideways, and thus obviating the need for 1/3 of the screen for mostly whitespace.
i do like that the departure times are (slightly) more accurate because of the crowd-sourcing. however, the underlying data from metro is a mess, so they end up looking bad anyway because trains and buses still show up (or don't) unexpectedly due to metro's unreliable data.
I like Transit when it works, but (as of a year ago) it routinely crashed. And transit directions are uniquely hard to restart midway, as it's hard for the app to detect what bus you're on without knowing when you got on.
I like Transit for their quick at a glance public transit arrival times in NYC, but generally prefer Citymapper's overall step-by-step directions and multi-modal transit options. That being said Citymapper did put a bunch of things behind a paywall in the last few years that have made it less useful outside of pure public-transit directions.
I've used Citymapper for maybe 5 years, and while I remain a fan, Transit[0] just seems like a much better product. They support more cities, their user tracking is (generally) more accurate, and (at least in my opinion) their app just better designed & thought out for transit use.
Transit is also really, really good if you know where you’re headed but just need to check train/bus arrival times. The app opens straight to live arrival times of all the lines nearest to you. So handy.
Marius here - VP Engineering for Citymapper (powered by Via)
We are excited about the opportunities this creates for the product and team. We are looking forward to join an excellent tech company.
Happy to answer any questions.
And we are hiring as we are expanding our product and team. For openings to work on the Citymapper app and tech please visit https://citymapper.com/jobs or write to marius@citymapper.com
Hi, your app depends on Google. I can't use it on LineageOS without installing Google services. Isn't Google your top competitor ? Isn't it a problem, that to use your app you need to use an OS that comes with an uninstallable version of Google Maps ?
There is actually a great coverage area overlap between VIA and Citymapper - esp. in North America and Europe. I wouldn't expect Europe not not be a focus given the huge transit market size.
We run a large deployment of services to support millions of daily active users across the 450+ cities that the Citymapper app operates in - all on AWS EKS.
Most of the code of the backend services is written in Python and we have CPP and some Go services or modules as we deal with a lot of CPU and memory intensive workloads (eg routing) as well as high I/O workloads (we are using 1000s of different data sources)
The apps and SDK are written in Kotlin / Swift / React
I know a few people who worked at Citymapper in senior roles, and the general consensus has always been that there was ultimately no feasible way to monetise.
As others have pointed out, their core value of routing/planning/exploiting Open Data became heavily commoditised by Apple, Google, and the transport operators themselves (e.g. TfL in London). Their belated attempts to monetise payments, data, even running transport itself, haven't been successful: it's a crowded, aggressive market filled with long-time incumbents who have established relationships and deep strategic control points.
As a place to work / founder values... ..well, the reviews on Glassdoor speak for themselves. I can't say I'm grieving for its loss.
For people who use either of these apps, what advantages do they offer over google maps transit directions? I live in Chicago and only use google maps but I would love to use something else that is more accurate with bus timings.
I use Citymapper all the time for the NYC subway, and I recommend it to everyone I meet.
1. Most accurate arrival times (this matters _a lot_ for transfers)
2. If your trip has transfers, it takes into account how long it takes to walk between platforms (some apps assume its instant, but if it's a large station it can take the better part of 10 minutes to get to another train)
3. Tells you which part of the train (forward, middle, back) to sit in so you're closest to the exit when you get off
4. Service changes are accurate and automatically included in the routing
5. Powerful routing options -- if it's raining, you can prioritize routes with less walking, or if you have a Citibike membership you can create routes that combine biking + transit, etc.
It's honestly good enough that I pay $20/year for it. Every once in a while I give Apple Maps or Transit a shot, but they're just not on the same level.
> 4. Service changes are accurate and automatically included in the routing
I'm not sure if this is the case with Citymapper. Transit does offer alternatives, but I don't think I've ever encountered this with Citymapper, i.e., you're committed to a particular route once you start. With Transit, I often get a suggestion (while on the train) that I might not make it in time for my connection with X train, and the next Y train leaves in Z minutes. I feel with Citymapper I only get something like this if alternate trains were part of the initial route segment, eg, N/R/Q trains. I also feel Citymapper does a much worse job updating ETAs or arrival times for alternative trains than Transit.
For London at least, better routing, more accurate timings, and also accurate updates on things like strikes. It used to be significantly better but Google Maps released an update a few years ago that makes the gap relatively small though, but it is still better.
It's also surprisingly useful to have two mapping apps on mobile devices which otherwise make it difficult to have two separate routes open at once.
In Paris, France, Citymapper is very accurate about subway timings, walk timings, which exit to use, ... it's the most precise and efficient transit app available here from my experience.
In London, Citymapper shows the cost of each trip which can be very useful as there are often many routes that might take a similar amount of time but cost different (eg. sometimes you can take skip zone 1 for a few extra minutes or understand why you're paying extra when taking a train instead of tube in South London). It also recommends the best exit to take quite accurately for train/tube stations.
Citymapper is also much quicker to incorporate changed schedules and excludes delayed / cancelled trains from results within minutes of the changes being announced.
For altered schedules, Google is not only slower to react but also just posts a generic link to the TfL website - and you then have to parse the TfL notice yourself to understand which stations / bus stops are closed etc. The routes suggested by Google also still include cancelled trains / buses - it's your job to double check by visiting the TfL / train operator's websites.
Citymapper incorporates transit delays/outages. When I switched from using Google Maps several years ago, they didn't, and I haven't had much of a reason to switch back. Big difference between "based on average times, this is the fastest route" and "based on the latest information, this is the fastest route".
I think all the big apps use live transit info now. That said, Citymapper actively surfaces that it's rerouting because of cancellations on XYZ train, which is very helpful information. I don't see Google or Apple Maps suggesting routes with cancelled trains either, but without that information front and center it can be confusing if it's not a regular route.
Via is not a general-purpose transit system. Via is an on-demand customizable van service that is often used by municipalities. It would be a ride type in Citymapper, not a competitor to Citymapper.
Some cities, like the Park City area in Utah, integrate the busses and Via vans into a single app to optimize the use of both. Citymapper could do this in-app in the future, creating chained transit options.
I also live in Chicago and use CityMapper almost exclusively now. It gives way more detailed estimates for multiple transfers between bus and train and generally comes up with more/better routes for weird destinations.
I enabled (silent) push notifications for the routes and lines I use going to and from work. It is more convenient than searching for a route every time or visiting the transit agency website.
I use CityMapper solely for train and bus maps. I'm probably a minority, considering how increasingly hidden the maps button ends up getting with each release.
when I lived in NY / Philly, Citymapper was way ahead of Google maps in terms of transit info.
since moving to live in europe, I haven't had much use for Citymapper.
Fairly unrelated I guess but I'd love to work on navigation software of some sort. I worked on a project involving it in project and had quite a lot of fun with it, something very gratifying about making something useful for day to day.
I did apply to citymapper at some point to no avail unfortunately.
i wish you were hiring a product manager, as i'd love to help you fix the horrid UX on the departure details screen i just posted about. it's been there for years, and i can't imagine that anyone who actually uses the app would have let it go that long without fixing it.
Readit News
If you can identify a niche and keep your costs down then you might have a chance. Apps targeted at enthusiast cyclists continue to do well, for example, although I have my doubts about expenditure vs revenue for some of them. (Disclaimer: I run a small-scale cycle routing app/site.)
But "people who want to get around Western European and North American cities" is not a niche that Apple/Google were ever going to overlook.
[1] "Citymapper investors are mostly not making their money back in the transaction and that it’s effectively a washout": https://techcrunch.com/2023/03/16/via-acquires-trip-planning...
Apple and Google tend to be slower to add suggestions like this because they scale poorly to other cities. But it's only a matter of time before they add them.
This never seems as useful as it should be because I'm missing a reliable way to know which direction a London Underground train will approach from?
There is a red stop light, but many stations have these at both ends of the platform. Is there some signage or other piece of infrastructure that gives it away?
[1] https://transitapp.com/
I've also had issues with Transit surfacing incorrect bus routes based on cancelled buses (but scheduled) which CityMapper somehow could account for. Transit knows the next scheduled bus two minutes away isn't "live" (icons are different) but still surfaces it as a primary suggestion, while Citymapper wouldn't.
The crowning feature of Transit is the GO trips that let you share you location while on a bus with others. For bus arrival accuracy there’s nothing better. It’s probably saved me a flight or two before, by just making sure I get the 747 bus to the airport.
i do like that the departure times are (slightly) more accurate because of the crowd-sourcing. however, the underlying data from metro is a mess, so they end up looking bad anyway because trains and buses still show up (or don't) unexpectedly due to metro's unreliable data.
They've dressed up the announcement so much that you can't even understand what they're announcing.
(More text, less pictures...)
https://ridewithvia.com/news/via-acquires-citymapper-to-expa...
(Edit: When I say informative... it's unfortunately still dripping in marketing-speak fluff).
[0]: https://transitapp.com/
Marius here - VP Engineering for Citymapper (powered by Via)
We are excited about the opportunities this creates for the product and team. We are looking forward to join an excellent tech company. Happy to answer any questions.
And we are hiring as we are expanding our product and team. For openings to work on the Citymapper app and tech please visit https://citymapper.com/jobs or write to marius@citymapper.com
Could you give an idea about the tech stack powering citymapper?
We run a large deployment of services to support millions of daily active users across the 450+ cities that the Citymapper app operates in - all on AWS EKS. Most of the code of the backend services is written in Python and we have CPP and some Go services or modules as we deal with a lot of CPU and memory intensive workloads (eg routing) as well as high I/O workloads (we are using 1000s of different data sources)
The apps and SDK are written in Kotlin / Swift / React
As others have pointed out, their core value of routing/planning/exploiting Open Data became heavily commoditised by Apple, Google, and the transport operators themselves (e.g. TfL in London). Their belated attempts to monetise payments, data, even running transport itself, haven't been successful: it's a crowded, aggressive market filled with long-time incumbents who have established relationships and deep strategic control points.
As a place to work / founder values... ..well, the reviews on Glassdoor speak for themselves. I can't say I'm grieving for its loss.
1. Most accurate arrival times (this matters _a lot_ for transfers)
2. If your trip has transfers, it takes into account how long it takes to walk between platforms (some apps assume its instant, but if it's a large station it can take the better part of 10 minutes to get to another train)
3. Tells you which part of the train (forward, middle, back) to sit in so you're closest to the exit when you get off
4. Service changes are accurate and automatically included in the routing
5. Powerful routing options -- if it's raining, you can prioritize routes with less walking, or if you have a Citibike membership you can create routes that combine biking + transit, etc.
It's honestly good enough that I pay $20/year for it. Every once in a while I give Apple Maps or Transit a shot, but they're just not on the same level.
I'm not sure if this is the case with Citymapper. Transit does offer alternatives, but I don't think I've ever encountered this with Citymapper, i.e., you're committed to a particular route once you start. With Transit, I often get a suggestion (while on the train) that I might not make it in time for my connection with X train, and the next Y train leaves in Z minutes. I feel with Citymapper I only get something like this if alternate trains were part of the initial route segment, eg, N/R/Q trains. I also feel Citymapper does a much worse job updating ETAs or arrival times for alternative trains than Transit.
It's also surprisingly useful to have two mapping apps on mobile devices which otherwise make it difficult to have two separate routes open at once.
Citymapper is also much quicker to incorporate changed schedules and excludes delayed / cancelled trains from results within minutes of the changes being announced.
For altered schedules, Google is not only slower to react but also just posts a generic link to the TfL website - and you then have to parse the TfL notice yourself to understand which stations / bus stops are closed etc. The routes suggested by Google also still include cancelled trains / buses - it's your job to double check by visiting the TfL / train operator's websites.
Some cities, like the Park City area in Utah, integrate the busses and Via vans into a single app to optimize the use of both. Citymapper could do this in-app in the future, creating chained transit options.
Also, the app oozes personality.
I did apply to citymapper at some point to no avail unfortunately.
https://transitapp.com/jobs
Citymapper is definitely hiring now. https://citymapper.com/jobs Or feel free to contact me directly on marius@citymapper.com