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martinald · 3 months ago
The UK already has (various) digital IDs but this is the 'new' one https://www.gov.uk/using-your-gov-uk-one-login. So what's going to be different? Just making it mandatory?

I can see some justification (sorta) for not making it mandatory, but saying it won't improve citizens lives is complete rubbish. Having one login for all government services would massively improve the efficiency, especially if other departments can share data (with consent ala oauth) with each other. Even in the NHS itself this would be a huge boon, if you get referred to two different NHS trusts they basically cannot see any other data. If all medical records could be linked to an ID (that is more sophisticated access control wise than the NHS number) it would actually be a huge boon for privacy/audit/logging.

OJFord · 3 months ago
Government website login isn't really a 'digital ID' is it? I've never thought of it like that anyway - could be used as one, maybe, but it isn't currently. E.g. you say this would help the NHS - well gov.uk login isn't any different from NHS app login is it? So the NHS already has 'digital ID' too.

(Don't expect this to solve multi-computer-system NHS though, ha! That's been tried and failed how many times, for how many billions? At least we have the app now, such as it is, I suppose.)

notahacker · 3 months ago
Yeah, gov.uk is a thing. But the Zeitgeist-y think seems to be blocking adult content and avoiding saying naughty things on social media, and no Keir, I'd rather not link my gov.uk login for permission to use those parts of the internet, thank you very much
stuaxo · 3 months ago
These systems are deliberately separate at the moment.
maleldil · 3 months ago
Brazil has a similar system (gov.br), which provides access to almost everything you might need from the government, including notary services, public healthcare records, driver's licenses, consulate services abroad, income tax, social security, unemployment benefits, welfare benefits, and more.

I also understand the privacy argument that arises from consolidating all these systems, and I'm generally pro-privacy, including in some extreme cases. However, this service makes life so much easier across many dimensions of daily life, and I think it's worth it. I can only hope that the GOV.UK login achieves a fraction of this.

basisword · 3 months ago
How would this solve the disparate NHS systems issue? The NHS id exists and is used by all of them. It's the various systems with no central data repository that is the problem. Throw in the fact that Scotland and NI have completely separate NHS's again and I don't see how another id ever solves it. The solution is bringing the NHS in all regions into the 21st century - which costs money they don't have.
mattmanser · 3 months ago
The already tried one login for all government services (Government Gateway Id), but they released it when all the services had their own tech teams and it was a general disaster.

Each service would issue you a different one.

It's not so bad now, but it's extremely irritating to have a number as the user id as when you run a business or two, you end up with more, and then you have no idea which is which.

sksksk · 3 months ago
One Login is an "authentication" system, an oAuth provider with identity added on. This means you can prove your identity once (to various levels of confidence, as defined in GPG45 [1]), and use that same verification across different government services.

When people talk about a national ID system, they're often talking about some form of "authorization", i.e. proving that you are entitled to certain things.

There currently isn't a system in the UK that can definitively prove that you have access to every service. For example, even being a British citizen and having a British passport doesn't automatically entitle you to access the NHS.

[1] https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/identity-proofing...

martinald · 3 months ago
No I get that but you could eg link your passport to the One Login and it'd make the UX much better for many services. For example, if you linked passport, driving license and NI/tax account, then I think for 99% of services you wouldn't need to fill anything in.

FWIW I was impressed with the DVLA driving license process, where you can type your passport number in and it pulls your photo from the passport. Very smooth. Could be even smoother if it could link automatically your passport.

pndy · 3 months ago
> Having one login for all government services would massively improve the efficiency

I'm quite surprised that's not a thing over there

In Poland you can log in into governmental services platform by: scanning QR code with a digital id app (requires authorizing it beforehand but once it's done it works like a charm), a separated national id card app - only for newer documents with rfid chip, 3rd-party login via bank (as long you pick bank that offers it - some smaller ones don't), a qualified digital certificate within yet another app. There should be another option for EU citizens who in theory would use their national SSO platform as a provider but seems it doesn't work right now.

That digital id app will likely integrate everything else since it already provides a way to secure your national id number (a SSN equivalent) and driving license, health services (doubling the functionality) and train tickets components.

A separated health service app is also available where you can manage prescriptions for medicines, referrals for tests and vaccinations.

stringsandchars · 3 months ago
OTOH - partly playing devil's advocate here - I'm dealing with several bank and inheritance-related issues in the UK from my home in Sweden now, and needing to do pretty much ANYTHING with an authority in the UK feels like stepping back into the 17th century.

There's a constant requirement for paperwork to prove who I am - always in the form of items that are 100% digital nowadays in the Nordic countries (like a "utility bill" or a "credit card statement" - on paper, posted by snail-mail to my home address!)

These then need to be 'notarized' by a legal person - with seals and embossed stamps before they can be used to identify me. It's medieval.

worldsayshi · 3 months ago
Swede here. I would not want to go back to days without BankID and related tools. That being said, the implementation has some less than desirable features. It's privately owned by some kind of joint venture by the banks. It only supports the major OS:s. So you're pretty much forced to own a Android or IPhone to function. Also, I haven't had the need to do this myself but taking care of somebody else's legal dealings (like an old parent or children) I understand is quite cumbersome. I think that kids are kind of forced to get BankID when they are quite young.

There are alternative implementations but I'm not aware of anyone that uses them.

It's more like we've slipped into this solution out of pure convenience than having made a deliberate choice.

monerozcash · 3 months ago
Absolutely hate BankID, making it too easy to integrate has resulted in businesses and the government requiring it in places where it's totally unnecessary.

I live overseas, don't have a Nordic bank account. Now when I'm occasionally visiting, I can't buy alcohol because the website requires me to prove my age with BankID.

This, as opposed to most of Europe where you can just have alcohol delivered without anybody asking you for ID at any point. I'd be happy to show an ID at the point of collection/delivery, but buying beer shouldn't require strong KYC.

Gud · 3 months ago
You can use the “säkerhetsdosa” to authorise yourself, at least with Swedbank. I use FreeBSD.

But yes. An open, free software solution would be welcome.

Saline9515 · 3 months ago
BankID is the worst of both worlds, where a private company can deny you the access to public services.
physicsguy · 3 months ago
> There's a constant requirement for paperwork to prove who I am - always in the form of items that are 100% digital nowadays in the Nordic countries (like a "utility bill" or a "credit card statement" - on paper, posted by snail-mail to my home address!)

These are always digital in the UK too. When I did my mortgage application I had to go to my bank, ask them to print me out a statement and then stamp it to 'verify' that it was real.

n4r9 · 3 months ago
I'm in the process of renewing my mortgage. Both my and my wife's banks allow you to export the most recent statement as a PDF, which we passed to the broker and have had no complaint. Same thing with the initial mortgage five years ago.
zahllos · 3 months ago
Agree. Proof of ID in the UK often means copies of utility bills. You can fill out your own with an online template pretty easily. Inside the UK you don't even need to bother with the notarization requirement. It is indeed backwards.

You can say "well you have a driving license" except if you're a teenager or an elderly person who surrendered theirs, you don't. You can also say "use a passport" but they're not convenient to carry and some people have never left the country so never owned one.

An ID card isn't a bad idea per se. It's the same as a driving license except everyone can have it.

What is bad in this round is the government making everyone have it on their phone "because digital is cheaper" (guarantee it will cost billions either way). Similar problems - what about people who don't have phones, how do you mandate I install this on my dumb phone?

The previous iteration might've worked had they not gone overboard on sequencing everyone's genome and giving every government agency and their dog access (only slight exaggeration) to the data.

jdietrich · 3 months ago
The clearest example of the deficiencies of identity documents in the UK is the "Right to Work" process.

If you're an employer, you are legally required to check that anyone you hire has the right to work in the UK. The penalty for hiring an illegal immigrant - even accidentally - is a £60,000 fine. The guidance on how to perform a Right to Work check is 60 pages. A whole industry of third-party identity verification providers has sprung up, because the system is so complex that most employers don't feel able to do it themselves.

Ironically, performing a right to work check on a legal migrant with a work permit is trivially easy, because we've digitalised the visa system. They give you their Home Office share code, you type it in to a website, and the website shows you a photo of that person and clearly states whether or not that person has the right to work. We already have a really good digital ID service, but British nationals can't use it.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6878ead80263c...

https://www.gov.uk/evisa/view-evisa-get-share-code-prove-imm...

afandian · 3 months ago
I visited Sweden this summer. One or two things accepted only Swish payment. Seems to be impossible for a visitor to use, you need to set it up with your bank.

I managed by asking a friend to use theirs. But don't assume that tech that "makes life easier" automatically means that it's inclusive. (See also parallel discussion today about EU Age Verification app [0]).

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45359074

Lio · 3 months ago
Part of the reason this is difficult maybe that there's an ongoing problem in the UK of foreign gangs using faked documents to steal inheritances[1][2].

I'm skeptical though whether a compulsory ID card for British nationals would help with that.

1. https://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/2025/shadow-world-the-grav...

2. https://www.theabi.org.uk/news/is-eastern-european-organised...

swiftcoder · 3 months ago
On the other-other hand, here in Spain we have universal digital IDs, and we still need notarised paper copies of every document for every official process. Sometimes these processes are lining enough pockets they will never die...
fidotron · 3 months ago
I too not long ago went through the inheritance gunk with the UK.

> These then need to be 'notarized' by a legal person - with seals and embossed stamps before they can be used to identify me. It's medieval.

My experience of this was they (the insurance/solicitors) were just being obstructionist for fun, because when confronted with the requested notarized documents they kept moving the goalposts around, and only a threat to withdraw business from them on other fronts made them snap out of it.

octo888 · 3 months ago
I haven't had any organisation insist on a paper copy of a bill/statement for probably 10 years now
SoftTalker · 3 months ago
Nor have I ever had to prove my identity to a utility company to initiate service, so I'm not sure why a bill or statement with a name on it is proof of anything.

And when my father died, the water and electric service stayed on in his name for another decade at the house. Nobody really seems to care as long as the bills get paid.

sschueller · 3 months ago
The Swiss are voting again for the e-ID this weekend. It is likely to pass this time although there are still some issues.

The implementation of the self custody wallet is open source: https://github.com/swiyu-admin-ch . What is missing is the verification system used to issue the ID which is not open at this time and the law is vague on who gets to ask for the ID. These two things still need to be settled.

zahllos · 3 months ago
Crucial point on this though: it isn't going to be mandatory. Swiss ID cards are not mandatory either although in practice not having one can be inconvenient.

Next year Swiss ID cards will come in two variants: biometric if you want to travel around the EU and existing plastic card if you just want to have it for Switzerland.

So you can even go so far as to opt out of biometrics providing you don't intend to travel internationally.

Dead Comment

willvarfar · 3 months ago
Digital ID works great in the nordic countries and doubtless elsewhere.
tokai · 3 months ago
It works. No need to call it great. Just the other month 35.000 danes lost access to their digital id because their phones are running too old android. There are edge cases where people get locked out of the system without access to public services, and why it is resolvable it can result in missed benefits and inturn missed rent payments.

I myself have experienced being between housing, and wasn't able to access my digital ID without an address, which I could only get if I could access my e-banking and pay deposit for my new place, but I needed digital ID to access the bank. It got resolved. But its a completely avoidable chaos that mainly is an issue for those with the least resources.

afandian · 3 months ago
Do you have more background links? Did it cause a national dialogue? Did anyone in government take accountability for that?

Deleted Comment

admissionsguy · 3 months ago
It can also be very difficult to get one if you are non-citizen.
worldsayshi · 3 months ago
It certainly works and is very convenient but there's certainly room for improvement on the privacy and agency front.
jjani · 3 months ago
Does it require using a Google or Apple product?
willvarfar · 3 months ago
Generally, yeah, to use the online government and financial services in Sweden need BankID, which is almost always on your mobile phone. You can also use a PC, although that is fading away.

ID cards are also a thing, and in principle every grownup should always be carrying ID although its not like everybody really does when walking around the park etc.

There are paper and in-person alternatives to the online services, but the ease and prevalence of the online services makes those actually relatively efficient. The times I've had to do something in person has all been slick.

I think underneath the key concept is that everyone has a unique ID number and means to prove it's them. 99% of the time that ends up being Mobile BankID.

kawsper · 3 months ago
The most common version does (in Denmark), but you can get a code display to login if you want: https://www.mitid.dk/en-gb/get-started-with-mitid/how-to-use...
nemomarx · 3 months ago
Why is the UK politics scene so focused on digital ID? Blair first proposed it and I feel like I've heard about it continually since with no progress. Different justifications every time too
physicsguy · 3 months ago
Because 20 years later, everyone has given their data away on TikTok anyway and we're still dealing with the same issues with different digital government ID numbers that aren't joined together at all.

I have (that I remember, probably more):

National Insurance Number

NHS Number

Unique Taxpayer Reference number

A student loan Customer Reference Number account number

A passport number

A government gateway ID number

A driving license number

An account with the land registry

gsck · 3 months ago
Best part about gov id, there is no link between accounts. I have my personal gov ID account, I have my director of a business gov ID account and I also have a gov ID account for the business.

Why are these all separate, why am I 2 people according to gov ID. Why can't I access my director of a business gov ID from my personal gov ID???

The kicker is these are all linked, it knows they all belong to the one person, but if you log into the wrong one it tells you to use the other one.

ronsor · 3 months ago
That isn't too different from America, where you have a social security number, driver's license number, passport number (possibly two if you also have a passport card), and any other random identification the government demands.
amoe_ · 3 months ago
I actually like this and don't want them to be joined up.
rainingmonkey · 3 months ago
The Tony Blair Institute still wields a lot of power in UK politics, and they're still pushing for ID cards.

https://institute.global/insights/tech-and-digitalisation/to...

evertedsphere · 3 months ago
>institute.global

hubris

binarymax · 3 months ago
The real question is why do all UK politicians, no matter their party, hate people so much?
pjc50 · 3 months ago
Newspapers. And the lurking pool of resentment of fellow Brits from many, especially older, voters.
octo888 · 3 months ago
Because they have to choose between liking people and making themselves/their friends rich, and they always pick the latter.
ronsor · 3 months ago
The real question is "why do all politicians hate people so much?"; and the answer is power and money.
LatteLazy · 3 months ago
The UK has a bunch of deeply divided issues: 40% want lower house prices and rents (tenants and would be buyers) and 40% want higher house prices and rents (landlords and owners). The same is true for taxes and immigration and crime/justice and welfare etc.

So governments are desperate NOT to do anything on most issues. And they are desperate to do SOMETHING (as a distraction) on issues seen as more neutral and less likely to offend vast numbers of people.

hollerith · 3 months ago
>40% want lower house prices and rents (tenants and would be buyers) and 40% want higher house prices and rents (landlords and owners).

I think it is more that the electorate and their agents don't know how (or disagree on how) to keep housing affordable or more precisely don't know how to avoid passing laws and regulations that have the unintended effect of raising the cost of housing.

that_guy_iain · 3 months ago
Because the UK does not have a national ID system like nearly every other country in Europe, the reason it goes nowhere is that it costs money and no one wants to spend the money on it.
nmeofthestate · 3 months ago
I don't think so. I think it raises peoples' hackles because it is "not something we do here" - English-speaking countries seem to not go with mandatory ID in the same way as continental Europe. Maybe a Napoleonic/Common-Law thing?

(Personally, I don't object to the idea).

OJFord · 3 months ago
And entrenched (if fading, perhaps) cultural opposition to it.
HankStallone · 3 months ago
Governments are always looking for better ways to track (and control) their subjects. The idea of a national ID[1] has been floated by various US politicians since before it would have been digital. Many Americans oppose it because they fear a government using it to round up dissenting citizens, and others oppose it because they fear it would be used to more effectively identify illegals (some oppose it on both grounds), so between them it's never gotten started.

The UK government does seem especially keen on the idea of a digital/video dystopia, though. Weird, like they're trying to prove Orwell right.

[1] Social Security numbers aren't unique and you aren't required to carry your SS card, so it doesn't work for that purpose.

Oarch · 3 months ago
Eric Arthur Blair, perchance?
mytailorisrich · 3 months ago
The new justification (to deter illegal immigration) is expecially obviously bogus because, as the law stands, people must already prove their "right to work" to get a job and their "right to rent" to rent accommodation. Illegal immigrants manage, they would manage, too, with digital IDs because some employers and landlords are fine exploiting them. Or the plan is in fact to be asked "papers, please" where ever you go and whatever you do.
davzie · 3 months ago
This is really easy to fake though and employers kind of have to take your word for it that the documentation you provide is real. I'm assuming a digital ID scheme will just bring all the data together and make it instantly verifiable for employers. I would normally be suspicious about this sort of thing but I do think a lack of a single entity bringing all the data together is limiting us technologically in the UK. What Estonia have done is awesome, it'd be cool for us to work toward something like that!
tomaytotomato · 3 months ago
You just cherry picked two examples which are not issues in other countries with ID cards.

ID cards can prove who is an illegal immigrant or not, and with the current atmosphere. I want to know and be confident that we can check people's status efficiently and correctly who's here.

Sure there might be some small process mishaps but for the safety of the nation, it is worth it.

vinay427 · 3 months ago
In particular, this is already done using a digital ID for foreign residents (at least on most visas) in the UK, which was phased in over the past few years.
kolektiv · 3 months ago
For me the objections in the UK is not really about the principle (although there are always going to be some privacy/liberty/etc. concerns in that sense), but about the likely implementation.

If we could be assured that whatever was put in place was genuinely privacy/security focused, had open and transparent governance, and wasn't susceptible to capture by corporations/other powerful actors, I suspect many people wouldn't be too bothered. But that's not really the offer, it never is with public IT infrastructure in the UK. The likelihood is that it would be farmed out to one more private corporations to build and maintain, generally for a lowest bid, and overseen by people without sufficient expertise to avert many/any of the potential harms from a poor implementation.

There are good ways to do things like this: public ownership, open governance, security/privacy baked in, all based on a reflective national conversation about trade-offs and the valid fears that many have. What people don't trust is not really the concept of ID cards, it is instead the track record of this and previous governments with both IT and privacy impacting legislation, and even more so the potential inclinations of future governments, particularly at a time when far-right parties are floating ideas like mass deportation of people legally entitled to be here.

Digital ID and a free society are not inherently opposed, but there is no sign that this or other administrations are sufficiently interested in, or aware of, the complexities involved to produce anything other than a semi-permanent disaster.

crimsoneer · 3 months ago
The COVID NHS APP was open source, secure and excellent?
kolektiv · 3 months ago
An anomaly for sure, and I think as much as anything else one caused by the fact that Covid meant that government couldn't do business as usual. It wasn't procured and developed in the usual way, it didn't have the usual political pressures and fights from all sides. Yes, it's an example of what could be done if government was insulated from the usual environment!
alecco · 3 months ago
In completely unrelated UK news:

Britain jumps into bed with Palantir in £1.5B defense pact https://www.theregister.com/2025/09/20/uk_palantir_defense_p...

204 points|rntn|4 days ago|134 comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45313793

unfitted2545 · 3 months ago
I learnt recently the head of Palantir's UK department is Oswald Mosley's grandson, that of course doesnt mean anything out right, but it's just interesting the way these things happen.
LatteLazy · 3 months ago
Chiming in as a Brit: I m generally opposed to this.

I already have a passport and that is digitalised and universal. Why not just use that?

The UK has a bad habit of launching these programs and not being able to deliver on them.

We have had National Insurance numbers for a long time, these are used to track income tax payments and benefits. But that doesn’t work apparently. So I had to set up a Unique Tax Reference number. Just to do my tax return. This involved several letters back and forth. Actual paper sent in the post over several weeks. The government already have all the tax information they just need me to do 20h of work because they can’t keep their files straight.

They made a mess of that. So I now have an additional Unique Tax Reference number. 2 unique IDs…

And they are still getting my taxes wrong. And writing to me about other peoples taxes/benefits payments because they have similar names and live in the same municipality.

Also, I’ve never had any difficulty proving who I am online when I want to. And I should not need to do so anymore than I already chose to.

memsom · 3 months ago
I half agree, but a passport is a mid sized paper book, and an ID card is plastic and credit card sized. A plastic card goes in my wallet. I do not want to carry my passport around with me - having done this previously in Europe (both to use as ID and to not leave it in the hotel room with no safe), it is very annoying.