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Posted by u/thisiswrongggg 3 years ago
Ask HN: Cloud certifications and job prospects. Is there a real connection?
As I'm getting a bit old (mid 40s) I'm thinking about getting an AWS certification in order to bump up my employability and better my standing in job market.

I'm wondering though if there's any tangible connection between the two. What has been your experience with these and similar certifications?

Terretta · 3 years ago
AWS certifications from AWS are reasonably legit.

That said, most certifications are a negative indicator of competence. This is supported by direct experience and research studies.

At the prior 3 institutions I was CTO, we routinely screened out resumes with a laundry list of certifications before even speaking to candidates.

Note this is not about having certifications, it’s about mediocre candidates attempting to signal competence on the resume by listing a pile of cert-mill nonsense. The negative correlation is so high, when hiring at scale just toss the ones with certs (but give recruiters a list of exceptions, e.g., AWS, CNCF, etc.).

// Again, there are exceptions, and AWS first party certifications are among them.

bearjaws · 3 years ago
I very positively favor engineers who took AWS certifications.

Even the most basic Solutions Associate means I can trust that you at least know what I mean when I say 'SQS', 'KMS' and 'ECS'.

I prefer every engineer at least have foundational knowledge of AWS. We use IaC to template out everything and put 'training wheels' on our infra, meaning engineers might not spend a ton of time in AWS, the real benefit is in communication. Especially since I want engineers to feel confident to use our IaC to build solutions that scale and discuss how it could better suit the engineering teams needs, rather than just having an 'OPs team' drive application decisions.

Bilal_io · 3 years ago
I know AWS is the most used cloud platform among the many out there. But wouldn't you be missing on really talented people that have only worked on Azure or Google Cloud for say 10 years? Or is it the expectation that any OPs engineer should know the fundamentals of all the big players?
trhoad · 3 years ago
I would say the skills are largely transferrable as the product offerings are analogous in many cases.
more_corn · 3 years ago
If my environment is AWS and someone has experience with GCP I’ll pass in favor of someone who knows AWS. The concepts are the same but the day to day is quite different.
bearjaws · 3 years ago
GCP and Azure is fine, although I hope they would take the time to learn AWS lingo.
clowen · 3 years ago
As a hiring manager, the certs are ok, but the experience is what matters.

I always ask engineers this "What do you think about the AWS documentation?" If you've had to actually parse through it yourself to learn how to get something working, that's more valuable.

Zealotux · 3 years ago
>What do you think about the AWS documentation?

Is "I only ever get things done by reading third-part AWS documentation" a valid answer in your book? :c)

more_corn · 3 years ago
Compare and contrast with GCP documentation.
hazmazlaz · 3 years ago
Honestly compared to all other cloud platforms I've used I find AWS documentation to be amazing. I use AWS all day every day in my job and the only resource I've needed 95% of the time is the AWS docs. It's my first and last stop mostly.
mountainriver · 3 years ago
Honestly if I see a cert I run the other direction. To me it speaks to the type of person, I would much rather see open source or just experience
jpitz · 3 years ago
That's frankly a fascinating response.

I have certs because my boss asked me to get them, as they play a part in his business' ability to obtain partner status with the various cloud vendors.

It is confusing to me that this chain of events would lead you to dismiss me out of hand, or make value judgements about what type of person I am.

mudrockbestgirl · 3 years ago
> It is confusing to me that this chain of events would lead you to dismiss me out of hand, or make value judgements about what type of person I am.

I don't think he's making value judgements based on the fact that you have certs, but rather based on the fact that you choose to put certs on your resume over something else, like an open source project. When people write their resumes they usually need to cut out things and include only the most important qualifications and experience for the job. So he's making the value judgement based on how you think about those certifications. They signal "this paper that anyone can get with a bunch of memorization and studying is the best I have"

I share a similar opinion. I wouldn't reject someone who put certs on their resume just based on that, but to me it's a negative signal. The same goes for people who put MOOCs on their resume.

danwee · 3 years ago
It's not about having them, it's about putting them on your Linkedin/CV.

I have read tons of tech books (many of them way better than certificates on the same topics). I do not list them on my Linkedin/CV.

primax · 3 years ago
I've heard that comment once or twice but never from someone who actually has experience hiring people
clusterhacks · 3 years ago
Years ago, I used some personal projects and a database certification to make some desired job changes. I advise any person to leverage both training (traditional education, certification, etc) along with a demonstrable portfolio of work to do the same. Even now, I occasionally do a MOOC and earn the certificate just for personal interest.

I hope hiring orgs don't run away from candidates simply because they undertook a certification. But I understand the caution - my org has had bad experiences with coursework-only MS in computer science career changers who turned out to not have any real skills and maybe not even any desire to learn any real skills.

dc-programmer · 3 years ago
I see how people come to adopt this perspective. However, because so many tech workers appear ambivalent about their job and tech in general, any signal indicating effort to take control of their career direction is positive.

Every member of a software team does not need to super star autodidact. In a lot of cases it would actually be counterproductive to have such a composition.

mountainriver · 3 years ago
Thats a fair point, showing some level of effort is better than none. I generally want teams with just a few rockstars than a bunch of decent engineers. I've just found them to output far more at higher quality.
more_corn · 3 years ago
I tend to be skeptical of a resume heavy in certifications, but if there’s real experience and a display of competence seeing AWS solutions architect certification is a plus not a minus.
shyn3 · 3 years ago
It really depends on where you want to work. If you want to work at a large organization, I really recommend it. Thing big blue and such. A lot of their government and f-500 contracts are with entities that have contracts which state, "all our employees/contractors are certified."

I have been told by recruiters they can easily double most people's salary, this is for AZ-204/400 certs.

nikau · 3 years ago
The AZ-900 exam reminded me of the Simpsons episode, "Pepsi? Partial credit!"
beaylott1986 · 3 years ago
In UK context, many job ads for DevOps/Platform/SRE/Cloud roles will ask for AWS SAA if AWS is being used. I see other certs listed far less, whether AWS or otherwise. AWS SAA does seem to be the best value one in this sense. I'm currently working on AWS SAP.and wondering if there is any point tbh as I hardly ever see on job ads.

The AWS SysOps Associate exam is actually far more rigorous - questions are harder IMHO and it has a lab now so I would personally view someone holding that more favourably.

All clouds have partner programmes (mostly agency consultants) where status is partly linked to number of certified staff at different levels. For AWS specialty certs count same as professional in partner programme so for AWS partners they should just get them to do the easy AWS specialties like security instead of SAP.

I think the certs just help to get CV in front of people, they won't help much after that.

akulbe · 3 years ago
I have 6 certs, earned over almost 30 years in the business.

They used to be flashy, eye-catching perhaps.

Now… I would say they don't mean much.

Knowledge? Experience? NOW we're talkin.

As one other comment suggests, they help you get vendor status… but if you don't have the requisite knowledge to back up the paper, they're not worth the paper they're printed on.

more_corn · 3 years ago
I was doing aws for years before I sat the solutions architect exam. I learned a lot and would recommend it to anyone operating in the space. I hire and having that cert goes a long way towards showing you know your way around AWS.