Tesla used to be: Unmatched software(+), unmatched electronics(+), Save the planet(+), great subsidies(+), electric car that doesn't look weird(+), USA and Startups and the future(+), unmatched acceleration(+), low built quality(-), Shitty driving dynamics(-)
Now alternatives are pretty good, so still Unmatched software(+) but the difference is not that big and the rest doesn't look good. No longer saving the planet because you don't save the planet with fascists, USA is no longer cool(hostile and clown-like), tech guys are no longer cool(greedy and sleazy and meddle with politics instead of doing cool shit), the design is dated and boring now and there are many alternatives doing much better in many other characteristics.
So Tesla still sells very well when the price is right, match the new situation and it sells. Tasla sells like hot cakes in Turkey for example because they introduced a version specifically for the Turkish regulations and that particular configuration is taxed just %10 when the cheapest petrol cars are taxed %80. AFAIK Tesla keeps selling well in Norway too.
This is spot on, I bought a BYD instead of a Tesla because of the reasons above. The build quality was better, the subsidy was great, and the Tesla brand is associated with Musk, so it's not a brand I personally want to touch.
Brand image is really important ev where already better in china than any other place in the world before Tesla but Tesla give the allure that the tech need to have mass appeal.
That's why it was so successful as a company
In Europe EV adoption is really driven by a concerted effort by individual buyers wanting to make green choices. And Musk has completely alienated all support from that buyer base. I don't see Tesla ever recovering its green credentials, and as a consequence ever recovering its sales or second-hand value.
The company fleets are a thing of the past in my part of Europe so I didn't have them in mind when I was making my comment.
I would speculate that European fleet purchasers in other parts of Europe would be wary of buying Teslas now partly because of the current trade war stuff and also with an eye on the resale value at end of lease; its really hard to shift a second hand Tesla these days.
What’s the point in a luxury brand where you’re embarrassed to be seen displaying the logo? I don’t think I’ve ever seen brand impairment like this that didn’t result in the brand being retired. The only way forward I can see for them in Europe is partnership with a European firm and I can’t see that working either.
Do people really care about this that much? The European company that made my car probably uses its social media and ad presence to spread progressivism, which I’m completely against, but what are we supposed to do, find and buy only from companies that we identify with politically? That would be very hard and limiting. And somewhat stupid too (as stupid as a car company taking a political stance, or people that think that buying from some company means you identify with their politics, but here we are!)
Do people care that one of the most powerful men in the world has become an enthusiastic cheerleader for the ignorant beliefs and dangerous rhetoric that led to the deadliest war in human history?
If you think "progressivism" is somehow on equal footing as one of the worst genocides in history then you are morally bankrupt. Several of my family died under the Nazi regime, and I'm not even Jewish or other Untermensch group. This is not unusual in Europe. There's a reason purchases dropped off a cliff after the Sieg Heil specifically, and not before when he merely had some questionable politics.
Aside problems with Musk it has to be said that the model lineup of Tesla is poor by today’s Euopean standards. We have lots of models and brands available in all sizes, luxurious and expensive to small and fun. Tesla was a great choice in 2019, but now it is just one among many and it doesn’t boast a great design or interesting imterior.
Even in the US, Tesla has problems with lack of variety.
In my case, almost nothing they sell fits in my garage. Even their shortest (Model 3) just barely fits, and there’s no hatch variant like I’d prefer, so I’m leasing a Nissan Ariya and will probably switch to one of those next-gen Leafs afterwards.
I have 2 or 3 neighbors that solved that problem by parking in the driveway. I think the car would fit in the garage but ~75% of my neighbors use their garage as an extra room to store shit.
Instead of worrying about the richest man in the world, feel sympathy for the people actively dying from his “wood chipper” tactics: https://archive.is/25XCC
Not much, I guess. His bad behavior goes back a long way, and has hurt many people around him. He used to lie publicly about his first child having died in his arms, when it was the mother's, just to provide a stark example.
He has enough bills to wipe his tears away with, unlike others.
I suspect some of the more recent behavior is attributable to or influenced by drug use, and I feel some sympathy for anyone who comes under their thrall.
You can feel sympathy for a person without agreeing with them or having the same viewpoints. I hope there are people out there that feel bad for another living being.
Does anybody feel sympathy for a terrorist? If your answer is yes, then you're unsympathetic towards numerous innocent others who have or may fall prey to them. Your sympathy becomes selective and meaningless.
This might sound like a hyperbole, but the comparison to terrorism is relevant here. The DOGE cuts have a cost in terms of human lives. I have no conclusive sources to show for it, but some estimates put it at 300K till date. Even Bill Gates criticized it. And Elon laughed and scoffed at it when he was asked about it. Drugs are not an excuse for any of it, since it was his choice and nobody's addiction should cause the deaths of thousands. Frankly, the greed of billionaires seem to have a bigger cost in terms of suffering and lives than even terrorists do. So please stop giving these humans devoid of any empathy, the benefit of your humanity.
Which is precisely why the company cannot split with Elon, and people who think it will are deluded.
Elon has a very loose association with truth, in a manner that usually yields long prison sentences. For many years he has been engaging with what could accurately be called securities fraud, and there is always some amazing new mega revenue stream just around the corner. If Tesla fired Elon (in an imaginary world where he didn't control the board), any competent hire would have to seriously say ooof and point out all of the mega risks the company faces. With Elon it's all magic and fairy tales and soon a trillion super robots and robotaxis to Mars and...
Is anyone surprised by this? Europeans still vividly remember, and are reminded, of the cost of WWII. When the head of a company, no matter how trendy, sieg heils on stage (twice!) and then goes on to publicly appear at far-right german political rallies - europeans take note, and act accordingly.
Americans have a poor understanding of what’s going on with Teslas sales numbers because their market largely lacks the competition that exists elsewhere and so they overindex on lesser factors like Elon.
The real issue is simply that Tesla are attempting to maintain their pricing and margins while the cost of producing EVs is plummeting and the variety of options is increasing.
The result is that they are being severely undercut on price by BYD et al.
Tesla are going to have to either start cutting prices significantly, or accept being a low volume pseudo-premium offering.
I don't think it's just the Nazi salute to be honest. The reputational damage the US has suffered this year is insane and it's getting worse.
Since Trump was elected America has been awful to its allies, specially Canada and EU. Many Europeans, are avoiding spending money on American companies, much less one owned by Musk.
Maybe it’s the fault of my US centric education, but I must be forgetting that part of Europe that had a fun time during WWII. Even the Swiss spent the time preparing for the other shoe to drop.
Virtually everywhere in Europe, broadly defined, was either directly involved in WW2 or was severely impacted by it while not technically being a combatant.
Readit News
I wouldn't romanticize it that much.
Tesla used to be: Unmatched software(+), unmatched electronics(+), Save the planet(+), great subsidies(+), electric car that doesn't look weird(+), USA and Startups and the future(+), unmatched acceleration(+), low built quality(-), Shitty driving dynamics(-)
Now alternatives are pretty good, so still Unmatched software(+) but the difference is not that big and the rest doesn't look good. No longer saving the planet because you don't save the planet with fascists, USA is no longer cool(hostile and clown-like), tech guys are no longer cool(greedy and sleazy and meddle with politics instead of doing cool shit), the design is dated and boring now and there are many alternatives doing much better in many other characteristics.
So Tesla still sells very well when the price is right, match the new situation and it sells. Tasla sells like hot cakes in Turkey for example because they introduced a version specifically for the Turkish regulations and that particular configuration is taxed just %10 when the cheapest petrol cars are taxed %80. AFAIK Tesla keeps selling well in Norway too.
No turn signal stalks? Need to quickly reverse if you stuck your nose out too far? (no stalk anymore) Need defrost now? (search on touchscreen)
I think it's now "cost-cuting ergonomic poverty", sort of like how macs lost too many ports.
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Is that true? I would have bet that the adoption is driven by company fleet cars and incentives.
I would speculate that European fleet purchasers in other parts of Europe would be wary of buying Teslas now partly because of the current trade war stuff and also with an eye on the resale value at end of lease; its really hard to shift a second hand Tesla these days.
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That would be nice but it is mostly driven by EU-wide fleet emission rules and individual country subsidies/taxes.
The UK has definitely seen it before!
Yes, I believe they do.
When I personally know two cases of that, 70 years old disconnected from internet vitriol, I assume it's absolutely dead.
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In my case, almost nothing they sell fits in my garage. Even their shortest (Model 3) just barely fits, and there’s no hatch variant like I’d prefer, so I’m leasing a Nissan Ariya and will probably switch to one of those next-gen Leafs afterwards.
Also all their cars (with the exception of the Cybertruck) literally look the same (like Neo in that scene from the Matrix where he has no mouth).
Therefore, let's honor Elon's words and rejoice at his misfortune.
He has enough bills to wipe his tears away with, unlike others.
I suspect some of the more recent behavior is attributable to or influenced by drug use, and I feel some sympathy for anyone who comes under their thrall.
Also drugs.
Edit: Yikes. Also, sympathy ≠ empathy.
This might sound like a hyperbole, but the comparison to terrorism is relevant here. The DOGE cuts have a cost in terms of human lives. I have no conclusive sources to show for it, but some estimates put it at 300K till date. Even Bill Gates criticized it. And Elon laughed and scoffed at it when he was asked about it. Drugs are not an excuse for any of it, since it was his choice and nobody's addiction should cause the deaths of thousands. Frankly, the greed of billionaires seem to have a bigger cost in terms of suffering and lives than even terrorists do. So please stop giving these humans devoid of any empathy, the benefit of your humanity.
Elon has a very loose association with truth, in a manner that usually yields long prison sentences. For many years he has been engaging with what could accurately be called securities fraud, and there is always some amazing new mega revenue stream just around the corner. If Tesla fired Elon (in an imaginary world where he didn't control the board), any competent hire would have to seriously say ooof and point out all of the mega risks the company faces. With Elon it's all magic and fairy tales and soon a trillion super robots and robotaxis to Mars and...
The real issue is simply that Tesla are attempting to maintain their pricing and margins while the cost of producing EVs is plummeting and the variety of options is increasing.
The result is that they are being severely undercut on price by BYD et al.
Tesla are going to have to either start cutting prices significantly, or accept being a low volume pseudo-premium offering.
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Since Trump was elected America has been awful to its allies, specially Canada and EU. Many Europeans, are avoiding spending money on American companies, much less one owned by Musk.
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You’re only getting a tax discount with BEV, but no purchase discounts financed from taxes.