The most proven anti-aging for skin, that I'm aware of, is prevention of UV rays damaging the skin.
Sunscreens are amazing "anti-aging" formulas.
Interesting fact: sunscreens are not proven to prevent melanoma; only basal cell carcinoma and other skin cancers. Beware I said "proven". They may, but evidence is not there yet, as of last time I checked.
Speaking of UV-A, I’m not a conspiracy theorist on this, but it reminded me that a common retort I’ve read given to “RF, routers, etc cause cancer” theories is that those are non-ionizing radiation and therefore are safe.
Yet, UV-A is non-ionizing and definitely does cause cancer. Just a random brain connection that was made.
I'm in my mid/late 50s, and had grandparents from Ireland, that is, I'm light skinned. As a kid my brothers and I would compete who could peel off the longest continuous strip of skin a day or two after going to the beach.
Anyway, the skin on my exposed arms looks like "old man" skin -- lots of blotches, and more importantly not elastic. However, the skin that lives under my short sleeves is not only unblemished, it is as elastic as when I was a teenager.
In short: yes, it will help against cosmetic damage as well as skin cancer.
Bonus: the youtube channel veritasium did a video a few years ago where they use a UV filter on a camera to show (a) the effectiveness of sunscreen and (b) the damage which is visible in the UV years before it shows up in visible light.
> One group of ingredient that ASAP Science does recommend, alongside antioxidants and retinol, are palmitoyl polypeptides – if you use all three then you’re checking all the boxes for science-backed anti-aging skincare.
That paragraph sums it up but according to the article not all retinoids are the same. Read on for more scientific information on what's out there for your specific skin care needs.
I wish they made some recommendations and application schedule. That statement alone makes is very hard to figure out which products are legit and which are not.
The average reader (me) just wants to buy 3 products, use them nightly, and move on, without doing hours of research.
I recommend The Ordinary skincare company [1] which makes everything on the list. For example, this what I use for retinol [2] and the polypeptides [3]. Just read and follow their directions carefully because they sell some concentrated stuff that can do some harm in inexperienced hands (you don't need those products so just read the product page carefully to avoid them).
Source: family member is a biophysicist and looks a good 10/20 years younger so I just follow their lead. As an engineer the no nonsense product lineup appeals to me (no affiliation).
From what I remember from Labmuffin's past articles, she doesn't give a specific nightcare routine because it varies based on the individual, so some trial and error is required.
Maybe that's a bit of a cop out, but if there were a perfect combination then there wouldn't need to be so many different products (marketing aside, even the same formulations of active ingredients are available as washes, creams, lotions, serums, peels, etc).
There are other non-ingredient things that matter: limiting sun exposure, cleaning the oil/dirt, and using something to maintain hydration (glycerin, aqueous cream, ... petroleum jelly in extreme cases).
I need something to reasonably explain to my wife that all these things don't work, the brand indoctrination is profound and the credit card bills hefty.
Any good study on all the things that don't work?
I think if you're coming at it from an angle where you're going to sit your wife down on the couch, show her some studies, and then wait for the "thank you for clarifying my thinking!" to roll in, you're doomed to fail / upset your SO.
I think the personality types you generally find in tech, which are so focused on what we can produce / output, don't understand that consumption is a perfectly valid hobby or interest for people to have.
I'd wager very few people actually buy the miracle claims on the products. I think they instead just find it fun. I gave my SO a lot of crap before realizing that some people just find stewardship of an object enjoyable. There's a whole subculture related to it. The ownership, displaying, and usage _is_ the hobby.
I doubt the majority of people using expensive skin care creams are actually doing it just for fun and not for any actual benefit.
It's more common to hear people say, "it probably isn't doing much, but you never know." This is similar to people buying lottery tickets, "I doubt I'll win, but you never know."
"I just enjoy it, ok?" is probably what someone would say to get rid of a pestering husband. :)
More than a hobby, it's like a gender roleplaying ritual for identity construction. ( And class I guess if it's expensive. Same reason me think golf is fun)
I'd wager very few people actually buy the miracle claims on the products. I think they instead just find it fun. I gave my SO a lot of crap before realizing that some people just find stewardship of an object enjoyable. There's a whole subculture related to it. The ownership, displaying, and usage _is_ the hobby.
An alternative is that bringing up this type of topic ends up sounding like some form of:
"Hey, you know all that stuff that stresses you out everyday? Well, regarding one of the less important ones, you are doing it totally wrong and I want you to correct yourself."
Even you are technically right, there is very little upside to bringing it up, especially out of nowhere. Assuming, of course, they aren't doing anything wildly dangerous.
More like, people want the illusion that they can make themselves more attractive. If you say the truth, "Well dear, your skin's current appearance is a combination of genetics and avoiding the sun," then you've basically said, "You can't undo the past, therefore all hope is lost. Also, you're stupid for thinking this cream can help you."
This comment is a wonderful template to consider. In my personal context, this would be about leaving a certain very-American religion and being the more-or-less first to take plunge: you really wanna share your "greater truth" and help those close to you unburden themselves by letting go of something so obviously false.
You really can't "red pill" people, and the closer they are to you the lower the chances of success.
You can, however, ask (non leading) questions and listen. If you can't start by being curious, don't expect them to make that leap first... and thats really where you have to start before you can change your mind.
Speaking as a wife who never understood the attraction of expensive beauty products but has friends who love some irrational things, you might want to let that one go, unless your spare time is dedicated to home improvement, caring for the less fortunate, and/or managing your investments, because you don’t own hardware suitable for gaming, a motorcycle or a high-performance car.
And even then, you probably still want to let that one go. You likely also spend/waste money and time in ways that your wife finds less than rational. We are socialized to nag you a bit about it, but ultimately, not to take action against our men’s “harmless” wastes of money and time.
Separate checking accounts are underrated. My grandfather kept one paycheck a month, out of which he paid the mortgage, and gave the other to my grandmother, who paid all the other household expenses. What happened to the rest in each of their accounts was pretty much their own business.
* if her brand loyalty is to something sold by an MLM, then you do have cause for intervention - “I can get a fantastic discount by becoming a seller!” is the trap that catches a lot of women.
Because the science is so hard to do, the products are basically entertainment. If you think of it that way it's hard for me to get too upset -- when it's affordable.
Some products are flat out dangerous though, and regulation is scant.
When my MIL was dying of cancer eventually then sent her home and "prescribed" various homeopathic concoctions (German insurance covered all this). At first I was appalled but eventually realized that as there was nothing left to do for her, the homeopathic bottles of water were a form of palliative care: giving her a sense of agency. I came to realize that it was a kindness.
Wearing makeup is often less critical, but given how important appearance is in culture, literature, and stereotyping, providing a sense of agency can be of enormous psychological value.
I guess it depends on what type of skincare they are doing. My ex (Korean), had a 7 or 8 step routine each night. This is fairly normal for young women in Korea.
She explained it to me as such: it wasn't so much an anti-aging regime, as a protection from the elements regime -- in particular pollution, as South Korea has some trouble with seasonal fine dust. I suppose it makes sense. And for what its worth, her skin did have a healthy, shiny, glow after applying all the layers -- which is also part of the appeal.
Look at it this way: if it really had the long lasting effects that the ads wants you to believe it has, then it would be a medicine and wouldn’t be sold OTC.
Because it barely does anything at all and certainly won’t change your skin overtime, it doesn’t need FDA approval, isn’t prescription only, and isn’t a medicine.
It’s all marketing that makes you think it’s medical, but they never say it. They just advertise it with white lab coats, sciency sounding weasel words, mathematical looking curves and graphs… but it’s just overpriced and over marketed cream. Your brain is tricked into connecting the dots and concluding it’s medicine but they’ll never say it outright because they can’t because it’s not.
> Look at it this way: if it really had the long lasting effects that the ads wants you to believe it has, then it would be a medicine and wouldn’t be sold OTC.
I think this is a little simplistic. The FDA isn't inherently interested in anything effective being deemed a drug, even when it comes to oral supplementation.
Plenty of non-medicine, non-FDA-regulated substances that work like medicines in some situations and do have real, repeatable effects are sold OTC.
Plenty of actual medicines that are FDA-regulated are sold OTC.
There are plenty of effective skin care products with active FDA approved ingredients that are also OTC. Salicylic acid and benzoyl peroxide are two of them.
I've only seen one person venture into this battlefield, and it was a comedian doing a bit.
The guy is a very funny Aussie. It's Jim Jeffries. His bit went my girl comes to bed with oily skin from those pricy creams.
I tell her look at my face. Not a wrinkle, and I just use soap.
Anyway, when I saw a dermatologist in high school, for years it seemed? He would only recommend glycerin soap, and Certaphil if you have very dry skin. Benzoyl peroxide, erythromycin roll on lotion, and I was on erythromycin pills for bad acne. Think most pores blocked up. He detested dermatologists who sold out, and developed their own phony beauty creams.
This was when some doctors had integrity--80's? And it was starting to change.
My experience with dermatologists has been the opposite. Over the last 2 decades, the dermatologists I've seen mostly just recommended pretty basic stuff like gentler unscented soaps, moisturizers in general, or Vaseline/Aquaphor. That's not including actual prescription drugs of course.
It looks like the US part of Open Beauty Facts is still lacking (618 products in the USA, whereas there are 16500 products in France). Here visitors add products infos and images which are then free for all to use (open licence). I guess in the long run it can make a difference. This project is quite young.
I'm at the age where I should start taking better care of my skin, but when it comes to reading up on the science and then translating that into deciding on products to buy, my eyes just glaze over. Did anyone put together a simple list of scientifically supported products that I can smear on my face?
Science supports that the sun really damages your skin, so you should absolutely use a sunscreen or SPF 30 moisturizer every morning.
Digging deeper into types of ingredients that block sun, things get a bit more tricky. In general I’ve read dermatologists say “physical” sun screen ingredients are best, like zinc oxide, because they aren’t absorbed through your skin like a “chemical” ingredient. But they also leave your skin looking more white.
And beyond that, just wash your face in the morning and night with a face wash product, not bar soap. Something simple from Neutrogena (Liquid Neutrogena).
If you really are using sunscreen every day, you might want to have your vitamin d levels checked. Low vitamin d is associated with all sorts of adverse health outcomes.
I used to think it was a simple as using the sunscreens with metals in them to reflect the sun and the whiter you look, the more effective, but it looks pretty complicated when I did more research on how UVA and UVB are blocked.
For one, it seems legislation to study the ingredients in the US was only passed Nov 2019. Even the size of the titanium and zinc particles affects the effectiveness.
The Mayo Clinic link is probably the best summary, to just use something and avoid peak sun hours. But it seems the non metal sunscreen ingredients are also important to project via absorption.
I haven't found anything other than anecdotal accounts but I would love to see a study/more detailed article about Mother Dirt products[0] - I found them super interesting because of the different approach.
It is unfortunate that the most clinically backed skincare treatment, retinols, cause so many problems for rosacea sufferers. Not to mention, the 1-month of breakouts people experience when they begin using them.
Readit News
Sunscreens are amazing "anti-aging" formulas.
Interesting fact: sunscreens are not proven to prevent melanoma; only basal cell carcinoma and other skin cancers. Beware I said "proven". They may, but evidence is not there yet, as of last time I checked.
Yet, UV-A is non-ionizing and definitely does cause cancer. Just a random brain connection that was made.
Cosmetically as well, or only for skin cancer related stuff?
Anyway, the skin on my exposed arms looks like "old man" skin -- lots of blotches, and more importantly not elastic. However, the skin that lives under my short sleeves is not only unblemished, it is as elastic as when I was a teenager.
In short: yes, it will help against cosmetic damage as well as skin cancer.
Bonus: the youtube channel veritasium did a video a few years ago where they use a UV filter on a camera to show (a) the effectiveness of sunscreen and (b) the damage which is visible in the UV years before it shows up in visible light.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9K6gjR07Po
Here's a famous example: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trucker-accumulates-skin-damage...
That paragraph sums it up but according to the article not all retinoids are the same. Read on for more scientific information on what's out there for your specific skin care needs.
The average reader (me) just wants to buy 3 products, use them nightly, and move on, without doing hours of research.
Source: family member is a biophysicist and looks a good 10/20 years younger so I just follow their lead. As an engineer the no nonsense product lineup appeals to me (no affiliation).
[1] https://theordinary.deciem.com/us/theordinary_regimenguide.h...
[2] https://theordinary.deciem.com/us/rdn-granactive-retinoid-2p...
[3] https://theordinary.deciem.com/us/rdn-buffet-30ml.html
Maybe that's a bit of a cop out, but if there were a perfect combination then there wouldn't need to be so many different products (marketing aside, even the same formulations of active ingredients are available as washes, creams, lotions, serums, peels, etc).
I think the personality types you generally find in tech, which are so focused on what we can produce / output, don't understand that consumption is a perfectly valid hobby or interest for people to have.
I'd wager very few people actually buy the miracle claims on the products. I think they instead just find it fun. I gave my SO a lot of crap before realizing that some people just find stewardship of an object enjoyable. There's a whole subculture related to it. The ownership, displaying, and usage _is_ the hobby.
It's more common to hear people say, "it probably isn't doing much, but you never know." This is similar to people buying lottery tickets, "I doubt I'll win, but you never know."
"I just enjoy it, ok?" is probably what someone would say to get rid of a pestering husband. :)
An alternative is that bringing up this type of topic ends up sounding like some form of:
"Hey, you know all that stuff that stresses you out everyday? Well, regarding one of the less important ones, you are doing it totally wrong and I want you to correct yourself."
Even you are technically right, there is very little upside to bringing it up, especially out of nowhere. Assuming, of course, they aren't doing anything wildly dangerous.
Not if there are negative externalities associated with this hobby (i.e. fast fashion) which leads to ecological collapse and depletion of resources.
So most product will produce a small effect.
On top of that they smell good (rich), which is probably also an important part of the experience.
You really can't "red pill" people, and the closer they are to you the lower the chances of success.
You can, however, ask (non leading) questions and listen. If you can't start by being curious, don't expect them to make that leap first... and thats really where you have to start before you can change your mind.
its a completely emotional topic too, logic flew out the window already
theres a reason why marketers make huge bucks on cosmetics and diet pills.
No it is not.
https://examine.com/topics/wrinkles/
https://examine.com/topics/skin-quality/
https://examine.com/topics/skin-elasticity/
... among others.
Unfortunately there's not a lot of great science out there, which is crazy given that the cosmetics industry is nearing $0.5T annually.
And even then, you probably still want to let that one go. You likely also spend/waste money and time in ways that your wife finds less than rational. We are socialized to nag you a bit about it, but ultimately, not to take action against our men’s “harmless” wastes of money and time.
Separate checking accounts are underrated. My grandfather kept one paycheck a month, out of which he paid the mortgage, and gave the other to my grandmother, who paid all the other household expenses. What happened to the rest in each of their accounts was pretty much their own business.
* if her brand loyalty is to something sold by an MLM, then you do have cause for intervention - “I can get a fantastic discount by becoming a seller!” is the trap that catches a lot of women.
Some products are flat out dangerous though, and regulation is scant.
When my MIL was dying of cancer eventually then sent her home and "prescribed" various homeopathic concoctions (German insurance covered all this). At first I was appalled but eventually realized that as there was nothing left to do for her, the homeopathic bottles of water were a form of palliative care: giving her a sense of agency. I came to realize that it was a kindness.
Wearing makeup is often less critical, but given how important appearance is in culture, literature, and stereotyping, providing a sense of agency can be of enormous psychological value.
She explained it to me as such: it wasn't so much an anti-aging regime, as a protection from the elements regime -- in particular pollution, as South Korea has some trouble with seasonal fine dust. I suppose it makes sense. And for what its worth, her skin did have a healthy, shiny, glow after applying all the layers -- which is also part of the appeal.
Deleted Comment
Because it barely does anything at all and certainly won’t change your skin overtime, it doesn’t need FDA approval, isn’t prescription only, and isn’t a medicine.
It’s all marketing that makes you think it’s medical, but they never say it. They just advertise it with white lab coats, sciency sounding weasel words, mathematical looking curves and graphs… but it’s just overpriced and over marketed cream. Your brain is tricked into connecting the dots and concluding it’s medicine but they’ll never say it outright because they can’t because it’s not.
I think this is a little simplistic. The FDA isn't inherently interested in anything effective being deemed a drug, even when it comes to oral supplementation.
Plenty of non-medicine, non-FDA-regulated substances that work like medicines in some situations and do have real, repeatable effects are sold OTC.
Plenty of actual medicines that are FDA-regulated are sold OTC.
Deleted Comment
The guy is a very funny Aussie. It's Jim Jeffries. His bit went my girl comes to bed with oily skin from those pricy creams.
I tell her look at my face. Not a wrinkle, and I just use soap.
Anyway, when I saw a dermatologist in high school, for years it seemed? He would only recommend glycerin soap, and Certaphil if you have very dry skin. Benzoyl peroxide, erythromycin roll on lotion, and I was on erythromycin pills for bad acne. Think most pores blocked up. He detested dermatologists who sold out, and developed their own phony beauty creams.
This was when some doctors had integrity--80's? And it was starting to change.
Dead Comment
Open Beauty Facts : https://world.openbeautyfacts.org/
This database of products is a sister project of Open Food Facts : https://world.openfoodfacts.org/
Many apps are based on these two DB.
[0]: https://www.ewg.org/skindeep/
It looks like the US part of Open Beauty Facts is still lacking (618 products in the USA, whereas there are 16500 products in France). Here visitors add products infos and images which are then free for all to use (open licence). I guess in the long run it can make a difference. This project is quite young.
https://world.openbeautyfacts.org/who-we-are
https://world.openbeautyfacts.org/faq
She just lists out different options for different sub-categories. Dry skin might prefer a different medium than oily skin.
Overall there were 3 categories in that list - cleanser, moisturizer, and sunscreen. Pick one from each of the category that suits you.
Digging deeper into types of ingredients that block sun, things get a bit more tricky. In general I’ve read dermatologists say “physical” sun screen ingredients are best, like zinc oxide, because they aren’t absorbed through your skin like a “chemical” ingredient. But they also leave your skin looking more white.
And beyond that, just wash your face in the morning and night with a face wash product, not bar soap. Something simple from Neutrogena (Liquid Neutrogena).
https://www.healthline.com/health/beauty-skin-care/best-suns...
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/phpp.12214
https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/adult-health/in...
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3781714/
For one, it seems legislation to study the ingredients in the US was only passed Nov 2019. Even the size of the titanium and zinc particles affects the effectiveness.
The Mayo Clinic link is probably the best summary, to just use something and avoid peak sun hours. But it seems the non metal sunscreen ingredients are also important to project via absorption.
[0]: https://motherdirt.com/