I’m Peter Roberts, immigration attorney who does work for YC and startups. AMA

Just wanted to say that not enough people know about the Green Card Diversity Lottery https://www.dvlottery.state.gov.

The odds are kinda small and there are restrictions but I know at least three people who got their green card this way.

elbasti · 9 years ago

I've been told by attorneys that applying for the Green Card lottery does not come without risk--in fact it can prevent you from obtaining a non-immigrant visa.

For example, when applying for an F or J visa (student/post-doc, say) the consular officer will ask you if you have intent to emigrate. The only allowed answer is a firm "No and I have permanent connections to my home country."

If you've applied for the green card lottery in the past, the consular officer could interpret this as having intent to emigrate and then deny you on any other non dual-intent visas.

mehrdada · 9 years ago

IANAL, so take it with a grain of salt. This is a super conservative interpretation though. Anecdotally, I myself have received an F-1 visa despite having applied for diversity lottery (unsuccessfully). If I recall correctly, I may have at some point seen an explicit guidance on the DoS website to the effect that a mere DV lottery application (without a successful followup petition) is not necessarily indicative of immigrant intent for non-immigrant visa application purposes. I cannot find it though, the page seems to be 404ing.

mabbo · 9 years ago

This is really great to know. I'm on a TN visa, NAFTA based, which also has the "this is temporary and I dont plan to stay" stipulation.

proberts · 9 years ago

Good point and depending on country of nationality, the odds can in fact be pretty good.

ottoid · 9 years ago

Having been born in Oman, a country with historically low rates of immigration to the United States, I have never won in years of applications.

Are the odds still good?

senatorobama · 9 years ago

I'm an Australian citizen but was born in Pakistan. Do I go in the Australian queue or Pakistani queue for green card lottery?

toyg · 9 years ago

I tried once about 15 years ago and didn't succeed. I can imagine the pool of applicants is even larger these days, if it can be done via the internet.

mars4rp · 9 years ago

survival bias?

ronilan · 9 years ago

A decade+ ago I won the lottery on my third year trying. I got the winning notice the same month I got the Canadian immigrant visa (obtained as Skilled Worker) stamped in my passport. We chose to go to Vancouver.

I don't know about survivor bias but I think the movies were right. The odds are ever in you favor, and you can't see past the choices you don't understand ;)

adamnemecek · 9 years ago

I knew them when they were on their previous respective visas too.

Hi Peter, thanks for sharing info on what I feel is quite an unknown subject to an outsider. I have a general question for you:

As a skilled software developer with a relevant UK university degree (3 years BSC) and work place experience, interested in working in the US - What is the ballpark range of costs and wait time involved in getting a visa to allow me to work for a US company.

What's the general procedure, - get offer from job, then -talk to immigration lawyer, or the other way around?

Thanks!

anond · 9 years ago

(Not a lawyer, but US immigrant pretty familiar with E/F/H/J/L/O visas and Green card)

There are some exceptions but the procedure is usually : get a job offer from an employer that is willing to sponsor you, then talk to a lawyer... But a lawyer might be able to help you find ways to immigrate without a job offer, but that seems pretty unlikely to me.

The H-1B visa would normally be one of the 'classic' ways to be authorized to work in the US in your situation, the problem being that in recent years demand has far exceeded the available number (annual cap). For example this year 199,000 petitions were received during the first week, for only 85,000 H-1B available (including 20k for holders of advanced US degree). Therefore the USCIS now holds a lottery to determine which petitions will be reviewed first, and once 85k petitions are approved, you have to wait another year to apply...

The cost for an H-1B is nil for an H-1B as the employer has to pay for it and cannot ask you to reimburse those fees. You might have to pay in order to have dependants (wife, kids) added to your petition though.

The problem used to be to find an employer willing to sponsor you for the visa (the difficulty varies greatly depending on your industry), now the H-1B visa cap makes it more of a time issue unfortunately.

Other options you might look into depending on your how long you would like to work in the US: J-1 for an internship, E-2 for a company whose 'nationality' is the same as yours, L visas for a transfer to the same company in the US, F-1 visa for studies, and the O-1 visa which I will let you research by yourself and/or discuss with an attorney (the qualifications aren't as difficult at they may seem, trust me)

charris0 · 9 years ago

really appreciate this rough guide thanks!

ckorhonen · 9 years ago

Some experience here UK -> L1 -> GC -> Citizen.

It's worth considering the L-1 visa route - work in the UK office of a US-based company for 1 year and you become eligible.

One disadvantage, you are bound to the L-1 employer in the US unless you can get a H1-B, work visa or family-based visa (yes, I found myself a green card wife of nearly 10 years now).

The L-1 process was a lot of paperwork, but the sponsoring company paid. The rest we did ourselves without a lawyer. Big fan of http://www.visajourney.com - lots of folk in similar situations and howto guides.

Happy to talk more if it's helpful, either here or my username at gmail.

giobox · 9 years ago

I followed much the same route, but I can't recommend it as a strategy for someone looking for a path to the USA, given you have to work for said employer for a year then hope they will consider sponsoring you. Unless you have hard to find skills, I don't think many employers will offer this option at interview time, given you are still not a fully known quantity until you've actually started working somewhere. Those on L1s in this industry are usually there by accidents of fate rather than a grand plan in my experience!

The H1 or entering education in the USA are probably the two main methods, but even those have gotten significantly more difficult as others have pointed out (H1 cap etc).

proberts · 9 years ago

I would probably talk with an immigration attorney first to understand what is even possible because sometimes, unfortunately, there are no good immigration options.

whack · 9 years ago

What advice do you have for someone who's on a H1B visa, wants to co-found a startup, incorporate it, work on it part-time until it receives VC funding, and continue working at their H1B "day job" in the interim?

My understanding is that the H1B visa does not allow you to do any work for anyone apart from your visa sponsor. If a co-founder were to spend his evenings working on his startup which has been incorporated, I'm not sure if that would conflict with the above regulation, and if so, how to work around this.

I'd be happy to contact you privately if you prefer that.

It's possible to have two H-1B employers, one based on full-time employment and another based on part-time employment. This is referred to as concurrent H-1B employment and it requires two approved H-1B petitions.

nialv7 · 9 years ago

So it's possible to found a company to sponsor a H1B for myself?

Dead Comment

codingbear · 9 years ago

I have the same question as well.

That's right, in the H-1B context, there needs to be an employer-employee relationship between the petitioning company and the sponsored worker and this (in the eyes of USCIS) ultimately means the ability of the petitioning company to fire the sponsored worker and otherwise control his or her employment.

sctb · 9 years ago

Some previous threads with Peter:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14703052

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11972135

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10719080

throwaway45599 · 9 years ago

I have a criminal record in the UK. I was convicted approx 5 years ago for criminal damage, drunk and disorderly and resisting arrest. I was given a small fine in magistrates court.

I have otherwise a great record and have set up multiple companies employing approx 100 people here, including many awards and recognitions.

What are my chances of being able to move to the US?

I would need to review the court and police records to see if a waiver is required but based on what you are stating, even if a waiver were required, you would get one (although it's a 6+-month process to get a waiver).

Could you recommend an attorney in London I could speak to? I assumed I was a no go for a waiver.

joering2 · 9 years ago

Serious question: if you have setup multiple companies with 100 employees (per company or total?) then why move to USA? If you are UK-citizen then it would make more sense to stay in UK and continue your success, since you seem to be good at it!

SirHound · 9 years ago

The weather? Source: UK citizen wishing to move to the US.

csomar · 9 years ago

There are countless of reasons why people want to move to the US. From getting married, to living in Los Angeles, to business opportunities...

That's total. I still have the American dream, don't think we are scratching the surface in terms of possibilities.

quickthrower2 · 9 years ago

Bigger market. Venture capital.

calvinbhai · 9 years ago

I've used up all 6 yrs on H1b (including recapture) and currently transitioning to F1, I'm exploring the O-1 visa. I'm an Indian citizen, born in India.

Question 1: Can I qualify for an O-1 visa if I'm part of a company as a co-founder/CXO that's been accepted in Y-Combinator or similar programs? (does that satisfy the "attained membership in associations that require outstanding achievements....."?)

Question 2: In the mean time, if I want to register a company in the US (for liability reasons) to release a free app in the app store, can I do it under my current visa status (change of status from H1 to F1) if there are no plans of monetizing the app in the near future?

Thanks

Regarding your first question, acceptance into YC definitely carries a lot of weight and can go a long way toward supporting an O-1 petition. Regarding your second question, as long as you are not receiving any value for your work (with value not being limited to cash compensation), then I see no issue with your release of a free app to help others.

Follow up question based on "value not being limited to cash compensation"

So it'll work well until getting accepted into a program like ycombinator, but I'll have to explore the O-1 visa options after getting accepted? Thanks.

gcdvl · 9 years ago

I won the green card diversity lottery and will finalize the process in about a month when I land in the USA. After that I'll be a permanent resident. I'll stay for a few months to set things up, leave for a few more months to sell some property and then move there permanently.

If things don't go very well and I decide to relinquish the green card and return, will I be subject to any kind of exit tax?

Also, I'm having a lot of trouble setting up an address to receive the physical card. A PO Box or mail aggregator is not acceptable and I can only change the address up to the point of entry. This is a major concern for me because I don't have anyone in the USA that could receive it on my behalf.

Is it possible to use "General delivery" near my arrival airport to get the card? I ask because up to 2 weeks ago I didn't even know about that concept so I'm still exploring that possibility.

Thank you for your time.

Regarding your first question, you should consult a tax accountant but the short answer is that the penalty provision doesn't apply unless and until you have been a permanent resident for at least 8 years. Regarding your second question, this can be a real issue and one option is to hire an attorney for the sole purpose of having your green card delivered to him or her. Whoever this is should charge you next to nothing so this might make sense.

Thank you for your answer. I had read about the 8 year rule but was afraid that there might be any other condition (like making more than ~ 100K in one year)

Regarding the address, I didn't know hiring an attorney was possible for that because I keep reading that the address must be a residential address. It's ridiculous that this can't be updated after one lands, but such is life and bureaucracy.

I still have a few weeks and will try to hire someone in my arrival city remotely.

I take it from your answer, the "General Delivery" is not an option? I find that strange because that would imply me having to identify myself to get the mail, so in a way it's actually more reliable than using a friend's address.

Thank you for generously letting us use your time.

dev_throw · 9 years ago

Would applying for a green card on a TN Visa be considered a violation of the non dual-intent of the visa and prevent me from renewing/applying for TN Visa at the border?

Context: naturalized Canadian citizen (Indian born) on a TN Visa working in the states.

From what I have read, green card applications are determined by country of birth, and for India are upwards of 3 years. So, I would like to know if an application for a green card would jeopardize future TN Visas at the border.

Thanks a lot for doing this AMA, Peter!

Yes, although you can apply for a green card while in TN status, a green card filing could compromise your ability to obtain TN classification in the future.