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raxxor commented on Questions censored by DeepSeek   promptfoo.dev/blog/deepse... · Posted by u/typpo
bakugo · 7 months ago
The "distilled+quantized versions" are not the same model at all, they are existing models (Llama and Qwen) finetuned on outputs from the actual R1 model, and are not really comparable to the real thing.
raxxor · 7 months ago
That is semantics and they are strongly comparable with their input and output. Distillation is different to finetuning.

Sure, you could say that only running the 600+b model is running "the real thing"...

raxxor commented on Questions censored by DeepSeek   promptfoo.dev/blog/deepse... · Posted by u/typpo
antidumbass · 7 months ago
> I'm pretty sure it was running locally.

If this family member is experimenting with DeepSeek locally, they are an extremely unusual person and have spent upwards of $10,000 if not $200,000. [0]

> ...partially print the word, then in response to a trigger delete all the tokens generated to date and replace them...

It was not running locally. This is classic bolt-on censorship behavior. OpenAI does this if you ask certain questions too.

If everyone keeps loudly asking these questions about censorship, it seems inevitable that the political machine will realize weights can't be trivially censored. What will they do? Start imprisoning anyone who releases non-lobotomized open models. In the end, the mob will get what it wants.

[0] I am extremely surprised that a 15-year-long HN user has to ask this question, but you know what they say: the future is not fairly distributed.

raxxor · 7 months ago
You can run the quantized versions of DeepSeek locally with normal hardware just fine, even with very good performance. I have it running just now. With a decent consumer gaming GPU you can already get quite far.

It is quite interesting that this censorship survives quantization, perhaps the larger versions censor even more. But yes, there probably is an extra step that detects "controversial content" and then overwrites the output.

Since the data feeding DeepSeek is public, you can correct the censorship by building your own model. For that you need considerably more compute power though. Still, for the "small man", what they released is quite helpful despite the censorship.

At least you can retrace how it ends up in the model, which isn't true for most other open weight models, that cannot release their training data due to numerous reasons beyond "they don't want to".

raxxor commented on Mastodon.social Suspends Stallmansupport.org   techrights.org/n/2025/01/... · Posted by u/zoobab
raxxor · 7 months ago
Mastodon mods being that happy to ban people is the reason for me I never even bothered. And their behavior reflects on any instance, technically correct or not.

I can just as well use a Discord channel because economic interests are at least predictable and the same rules apply to anyone more or less. Or I could use a reddit sub with my political alignment because mods there are equally ban happy as well.

I would take a lot to convince me that members on prominent Mastodon instances are curious about other opinions, but something in the larger picture just doesn't add up.

That is fine though, but Mastodon currently cannot be a place for everyone, regardless of technical possibilities. And it should be said that a lot of Mastodon users were involved in the witch hunt against Stallman, so at least some of the prominent users seem to be toxic.

raxxor commented on Google says it will change Gulf of Mexico to 'Gulf of America' in Maps   cnbc.com/2025/01/27/googl... · Posted by u/ceejayoz
ggm · 7 months ago
> Google added that the name Gulf of Mexico will remain displayed for users in Mexico. Users in other countries will see both names, the company said.

They already do geofencing for Kashmir, there are laws in India which would put maps API consumers in legal peril, as well as google.

They've dealt with this kind of thing for years.

raxxor · 7 months ago
Surprised they didn't rename it to "Golf Of Peace And Freedom And Cuba".
raxxor commented on Show HN: DeepSeek Your HN Profile   hn-wrapped.kadoa.com/... · Posted by u/hubraumhugo
raxxor · 7 months ago
> Your idea of a perfect date is explaining why everyone should run their own email server

That is the price for living in a better world!

I have a young account because I forgot the pwd of my old one and that is probably because for my old account it says...

> You probably use a flip phone and tin foil hat to avoid big tech surveillance

...I didn't provide a mail info for HN, famously part of big tech.

raxxor commented on DeepSeek censorship: 1984 "rectifying" in real time   old.reddit.com/r/OpenAI/c... · Posted by u/orome
ok123456 · 7 months ago
When OpenAI does this, it's for "AI safety."

When a Chinese company does this, it's "literally '1984.'"

Which one is it?

raxxor · 7 months ago
The Chinese company also released the means to correct this though.
raxxor commented on The Illustrated DeepSeek-R1   newsletter.languagemodels... · Posted by u/amrrs
redcobra762 · 7 months ago
I didn’t say China bad, I said Westerners typically find the levels of oppression and censorship present in China to be of concern. I actually gave zero of my own judgement on China at all.

If you really think the Good vs. Evil narrative is wrong, why would you immediately go towards unrelated generic issues the West has? A neutral party would be more likely to acknowledge the problems with both sides, not reflexively try to change the subject!

Then again you didn’t claim to be a neutral party, did you?

raxxor · 7 months ago
The CEO did gave a statement about their motivation. Could be a lie, but he delivered and it is also vastly more sensible that what we often hear from other companies. Google and Meta are an exception for this space though.

Also, because not only the weights, but also the data is open, any propaganda can be identified and corrected. This is not the case for other models and what we have seen from Gemini, there certainly are "adaptations". I don't think Google had ill intent here, but this would fit what some would classify as propaganda.

raxxor commented on Google open-sources the Pebble OS   opensource.googleblog.com... · Posted by u/hexxeh
elevatedastalt · 7 months ago
People passing cynical comments at Google need to understand that at a big co like Google, something like this doesn't 'just happen'. It probably happened because some passionate L6/L7 engineer wanted to do it and pushed through the bureaucracy to get approvals for it, probably largely on their own time (by which I mean that this was at best a side-project for them and at worst a distraction that was losing them favor with their bosses). At every point in the process, they probably had to justify what they were doing to their leads, to lawyers, to privacy reviewers, who had no real stake in it and so had nothing to lose by saying No. They almost certainly won't receive any career progress out of this and would risk a setback if something slips through the cracks (such as some unredacted proprietary information).

They did it because they felt it was the right thing to do. Good things happen through the actions of individuals like this. We should acknowledge and celebrate it when they do, anti-big-tech cynicism can wait.

raxxor · 7 months ago
Which is ironic because Google needs to improve their reputation about sunsetting early. This is one of the main arguments for why many businesses for why they do not employ their alternatives
raxxor commented on DeepSeek releases Janus Pro, a text-to-image generator [pdf]   github.com/deepseek-ai/Ja... · Posted by u/reissbaker
tarkin2 · 7 months ago
Impressive, honestly. They're trying to become a mecca for innovation and research, trying to lead rather than follow, build a culture where innovation can spark future economic advantages, whereas OpenAI seem to more about monetisation currently, many of their researchers and scientists now departed. Under the aegis of a dictatorship they may be, but this encourages me more than anything OpenAI have said in a while.
raxxor · 7 months ago
Or any leading CEO in recent times. Could of course be the usual deceit, but at least in this case he already delivered.

All I heard from OpenAI was that we need regulation which maybe happen to fit their business interest.

raxxor commented on Open-R1: an open reproduction of DeepSeek-R1   huggingface.co/blog/open-... · Posted by u/jonbaer
nejsjsjsbsb · 7 months ago
I'm on team open source. To me the exciting thing was ollama downloading the 7B and running it on a 5yo cheap lonovo and getting a token rate similar to the first release of ChatGPT.

Running local on CPU opens so much possibilities for smart and privacy focused home devices that serve you.

In my test it hallucinated confidently but my interest is in simple second brain like rag. "Hey thingy, what is my schedule today?"

Need it to be a bit faster though as the thinking part adds a lot of latency.

raxxor · 7 months ago
The thinking is quite fascinating though, I love reading it. Especially when it notices something must be wrong. It will probably be very helpful to refine answer for itself and other models.

It does add latency of course, but I still think that I could provide all AI needs of my company (industrial production) with a simple older off the shelf PC. My GPU is decently recent, but the smallest model of the series and otherwise the machine is a rusty bucket.

I didn't test it thoroughly yet, but I have some invoices where I need to extract info and it did a perfect job until now. But I don't think there is any LLM yet that can do that without someone checking the output.

u/raxxor

KarmaCake day160December 27, 2024View Original