Readit News logoReadit News
limandoc commented on Ditching Obsidian and building my own   amberwilliams.io/blogs/bu... · Posted by u/williamsss
limandoc · 7 months ago
I have my own reasons why I left Obsidian and now building LimanDoc[1]. The enormous learning curve and a constant OCD itch (that I like to scratch) made me realise I am not actually improving my knowledge system. A constant hoarding is also putting an emotional pressure.

I like the offline part, but for me Canvas was the best tool. I am also building a P2P synchronization feature for LimanDoc, and having offline LLM support is coming soon too

[1] https://limandoc.com/

limandoc commented on Building a Knowledge System That Enhances Rather Than Replaces Thought   nsavage.substack.com/p/be... · Posted by u/nsavage
JellyBeanThief · a year ago
> the ability to organize things freely in space

This is the key. It's not enough for digital tools to just put things in folders or tag them. It's the links themselves that need elevation. People need to add metadata to links, they need to apply rules specifying what links to crawl and how to arrange them in space, they need to specify how content should be displayed in islands of connected content. Then they need to be able to arrange islands on a 2d, 2.5d, or 3d canvas.

We have information input and retrieval solved. For some reason it's taking a real long time for people to get to spread out.

limandoc · a year ago
This is the core principle of LimanDoc.com I am building, a canvas that holds files and diagrams, but most importantly an inner board (a folder) that you can see through.
limandoc commented on The Philosophy Behind LimanDoc: 2D Knowledge Organization Tool   limandoc.com/blog/the-phi... · Posted by u/limandoc
limandoc · a year ago
Hi hackers! Last time[1] I received a lot of feedback and compliments for LimanDoc which motivated me to write about what actually drives me to continue the development. I am curious to discuss these with you, specifically: do you miss these features/ideas in other similar applications?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41878836.

Edit: I see that AWS struggles, here is the post:

---- Over a dozen different note-taking, knowledge management, and productivity tools were tried before I started ideating over something simple, something visual, yet powerful enough to satisfy my needs. The vision was born not instantly - but over extensive research of what I want, what people love and dislike in other tools, and what I can actually program. As a software engineer, the last task was the easiest.

Other tools often end up locking into restrictive structures, endless information hoarding, and dependence on cloud systems that may not be around tomorrow. I have outlined a set of principles designed to give me true ownership and freedom over my knowledgebase. Here’s why I started this journey, perhaps you can find yourself here too.

1. File Is The King

In tools like Notion, we’re locked into proprietary “blocks” and structures that can’t easily transition into other programs. A file, in contrast, is universally accessible and can live independently of any single platform. I needed a tool that handles files so that I could use them with other apps. As an example, I want to visualize PDFs, Excel/Word, Markdown, and images, but edit or sign them with other programs.

What would happen if a tool like Notion or Evernote were to disappear tomorrow? Of course, you can export everything to HTML or PDF, but that is yucky to work with later on. With LimanDoc, my files are mine, forever, and I can use them wherever and with whatever other app I want.

2. Offline First

Cloud-based tools promise convenience but at the cost of privacy and independence. I wanted LimanDoc to empower me to take their files offline, ensuring their work remains accessible even without an internet connection. This is why I value tools like Obsidian and got many inspirations for LimanDoc. Something Roam Research could be one day.

This doesn’t mean LimanDoc can’t integrate with modern tools. Syncing with Google Drive, for example, remains an option, so I can still sync files to my work laptop when needed. However, the core philosophy is: my files, my network, and my control over the distribution. I can imagine the peace of mind knowing that even when syncing over a local network, my files never leave my private system. Albeit this P2P system and syncing over the local network is still in development, this is one of my goals to bring to the masses on.

2b. Moreover, with advances in neural processing, offline-first extends to local LLMs too. The goal is to bring AI-driven insights directly to you, without your data ever needing to go into the cloud. There are infinitely many cases where this can be useful: transcribe recorded meetings to text; summarize books and long PDFs; or draw a graph of an Excel file.

3. Zettelkasten Turned Into Note-Hoarding

For years, Zettelkasten has been the go-to framework for managing ideas and notes, but I find that it can quickly devolve into an endless library of information I don’t really need. Hoarding information doesn’t make me smarter—it makes finding what I actually need even harder. I praised Obsidian above, but besides the huge entry barrier, the over-engineered plugins make things worse - I was constantly reminded to "improve my system" once more like a drug addict. I mean, the graph view is cool, however that is the only dopamine I get from using Obsidian. But I don't need a shiny toy that distracts me - I need a tool to solve problems.

I believe that notes should be treated like stepping stones. Use them, learn from them, and once you’re done, let them go. In LimanDoc, I want to create a space that values clarity over clutter, motivating me to review and refine notes rather than hoard them. The goal is not to archive every idea but to simplify, understand, and discard what no longer serves me.

4. 2D Canvas: Knowledge is Visual, Not Just Stored

I need to visualize what I have in order to understand it better. Binding this feature with the files that are in my file system gives me a true power tool. Now, some apps also have canvases like Miro or Mural, but they are online, which means that if you want to edit a PDF, Excel, or Word, you will have to download it, do your work, and re-up

load it again. What in a mother of UX is this?

5. Infinite Zoom: Hierarchical Clarity with Fluidity

Knowledge isn’t always linear, and my tools should respect that. With LimanDoc, infinite zoom functionality allows me to create diagrams with files/documentation that grow organically. Let’s say I am developing an idea and want to break down a concept further. I simply create an inner board, which is a folder, and simply zoom in, creating a nested “board within a board” if needed. There is a beautiful concept called Zoomworld by Jef Raskin - read about it!

Feel like me? Then help me to improve LimanDoc by sending feature requests or bug reports to info[at]limandoc.com - I would be eternally grateful to see that my app is also useful to you.

limandoc commented on Show HN: Desktop app displaying files on a 2D canvas   limandoc.com/... · Posted by u/limandoc
dr_kiszonka · a year ago
It looks neat. One aspect that I didn't quite get from the clips was accessing "distant" documents. Let's say I work with two files. One file on the very surface and another a few levels deeper. Do I need to zoom in and zoom out all the time to compare the documents? In other words, is there an equivalent of two windows opened next to each other, even if the documents come from two very different locations?
limandoc · a year ago
There are tabs, like in a browser, so you can have two tabs for your usecase. Perhaps I can work on tab division, like I'm IDEs. I'll be also implementing a search functionality later to find the files and even searching across the content of files.

However for both files to be visually be on the same level, I am now thinking about shortcuts, where the original document will live in a distant folder (board), and you can view it from other board by creating a reference/shortcut to it. Possibilities are endless!

limandoc commented on Show HN: Desktop app displaying files on a 2D canvas   limandoc.com/... · Posted by u/limandoc
pilgrim0 · a year ago
I just revisited similar tools to understand better why I feel your tool has more appeal to me than the likes of miro, etc. and I realized I forgot to compliment the good parts. Yours felt way simpler, the ui doesn’t get in the way and that’s a huge plus. I wasn’t greeted with any pop ups, toasts and whatnot. It felt professional like the other software I use, and not a dystopian fragile virtual money grab toy. Those other tools feels enterprisey, thus yucky, cringey. On a subjective level I don't identify with corporate values that’s why I think your tool felt like the very first of its kind I have ever used, because the entire process/context aligned with my values as a hacker, independent researcher. It was a relevant experience for that matter!
limandoc · a year ago
Signing under the yucky and bloaty corporate part! I try to keep the landing page clean as well, it was quite important for me, as I want to use a tool, rather than a shiny toy. That is why I prefer simple text editors to Notion; it is a must-have for the my app to be compatible with outside software and not a vendor lock-in.
limandoc commented on Show HN: Desktop app displaying files on a 2D canvas   limandoc.com/... · Posted by u/limandoc
nemosaltat · a year ago
I agree! Visualizing a workflow or a project this way seems to have a ton of potential. I already keep most of my knowledge in Obsidian or template folder structures, and this provides a really neat way to visualize it.

An immediate use case that comes to mind is when I’m sending multiple file “deliverables” to a client— i.e. a quote, a report package, some spec sheets, and a relevant CAD diagram)— I could quickly arrange them on as previews on canvas with arrows to visually communicate how they relate and their relative importance rather using multiple paragraphs to explain the seven attachments.

limandoc · a year ago
This is a good use-case, thanks! I will be adding arrows quite soon too, but sharing and collaborating externally will take a while, hopefully you have joined waitlist :)
limandoc commented on Show HN: Desktop app displaying files on a 2D canvas   limandoc.com/... · Posted by u/limandoc
zelos · a year ago
Nice. Kind of like Jef Raskin suggested in The Humane Interface?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archy_(software)#Zoomworld

limandoc · a year ago
This is a great find, thanks! Indeed I had the vision of Zoomworld as described there. The Leaping concept is very intriguing I must say - will play with that for sure
limandoc commented on Show HN: Desktop app displaying files on a 2D canvas   limandoc.com/... · Posted by u/limandoc
mqoca · a year ago
Any reason why this needs admin rights in windows?
limandoc · a year ago
Does the installer needs admin rights? Or the app after installing it? One possible answer is that I self-signed the app rather than using 400$ code-signing authority - hence you might get warnings for the installer.

u/limandoc

KarmaCake day20July 3, 2023View Original