Readit News logoReadit News
EatingWithForks commented on Universities have disinvested from their presses just as much as their libraries   publicbooks.org/publisher... · Posted by u/theoldlove
whatshisface · 2 years ago
It might be naive but I imagine training students to make improvements to weapons systems increases government support of universities and training students to criticize the government decreases it.
EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
Like I said, the founding of such studies predates the increases in tuition. Trying to argue that specific academic studies causes tuition increases by making students mistrustful of government, but only several decades later, needs a lot of evidence for that kind of claim. There are far more direct, closely related situations, like the federal and state governments decreasing funding or the inverted proportion of funds coming from govt/grants vs student-paid tuition via the loan system.
EatingWithForks commented on Universities have disinvested from their presses just as much as their libraries   publicbooks.org/publisher... · Posted by u/theoldlove
bombcar · 2 years ago
You may find it worthwhile to reach out to local community colleges, because once you're "in the group" you can find people doing various things, and they're often not advertising, but will be willing to take a bit of cash on the side.
EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
I do, but I would argue that local community colleges is still most certainly in the "university system", just another tier/flavor of it. I would consider participating in community college activities to be participating in academic institution style activities that also happen at universities.
EatingWithForks commented on Universities have disinvested from their presses just as much as their libraries   publicbooks.org/publisher... · Posted by u/theoldlove
EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
I don't know if grievance studies is a cause of tuition bloat. Most of the departments I know to be labeled as grievance studies were founded well before tuition increased, so it makes not much sense to attribute them to increased tuition. The increase in tuition hews much more closely with the decrease in government funding to these institutions, which requires more tuition from students, which means students desires must be catered to... so increased lifestyle luxuries makes sense there...
EatingWithForks commented on Universities have disinvested from their presses just as much as their libraries   publicbooks.org/publisher... · Posted by u/theoldlove
throwing_away · 2 years ago
> The goal is to grow, not set back.

If you're a university, the goal is to fill up your university with satisfied customers and increase revenue.

If you're a student, the goal is to form social networks that you can later use to help in business.

If you're a politician, the goal is to increase college attendance rates.

If you're a hard-line right winger, the goal is actually to set undesirable groups back, but that's a pretty fringe position.

If you just want to learn and grow, you should avoid the university system entirely.

EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
> If you just want to learn and grow, you should avoid the university system entirely.

I disagree with this. The university system is really good for exposure, assuming that people who are attending the system actually take advantage of the exposure. e.g. I was able to take dedicated lessons in multiple languages, artistic mediums, theories in various fields, by experts in each field. Many of these experts were presenting their work for free outside of lessons, and often times provided free food and drink to boot! Also, because my institution was larger, we often had scholars travel here to present their various works and even little get-togethers where multiple scholars from multiple fields collaborated and presented work. For free! With free food and drink!

I can't get a single dedicated language instructor for my life nowadays, it's bullshit apps or stuff oriented towards children only. Same if I wanted to learn the basics of, say, a performance art, or painting. The best system I have nowadays for learning is mostly hacker spaces and maker spaces, but they're specialized in what they can teach me and don't often have the kind of dedicated experts "office hours" or anything like that.

EatingWithForks commented on Rhythm 0   en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhy... · Posted by u/board
rcoveson · 2 years ago
I wasn't trying to say art has no value, just that its value isn't in it being a source of conclusions. Art can raise questions that we wouldn't have had otherwise, and questions are the starting point of science (and that of further art).

> I don't know how you can scientifically glean any conclusion that the artist was trying to discover or perspect, here, as effectively as she is trying to do so.

This is what I disagree with. If there is a conclusion that you think you have drawn from this work, then you should re-frame it as a hypothesis and test it properly. Or just be content with the new questions, perspectives, and the experience of it. Just don't go saying that you learned something reliably predictive about how humans behave.

EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
How do I test it properly in science, except through what she did here? Genuinely asking. Am I paying people 10$ amazon gift cards for the opportunity to sexually assault a woman? VR-cut-and-drink-woman-blood?
EatingWithForks commented on Rhythm 0   en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhy... · Posted by u/board
esrauch · 2 years ago
I don't know, it seems pretty in pocket with seeing "this is an art exhibit and I want wild shit to happen".

Comparing it to a normal real world interaction where you expect people to just hang out and chat is ridiculous, if people just chatted it would be a totally failed set piece.

EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
I dunno, when I saw this, I wanted to draw flowers on her skin instead, since she provided the rose as reference, and I do a bit of art myself. If people instead painted her, put her in robes, braided her hair or something else nonviolent, wouldn't that also be a spectacle?
EatingWithForks commented on California's Governor Vetoes State Ban on Driverless Trucks   wired.com/story/californi... · Posted by u/mattas
kstrauser · 2 years ago
I get why it sucks, but every day someone resists retraining from a dying or dead occupation is a day they’re not getting experience in a new job. In the case of the coal miners, those jobs were gone. No amount of bargaining would bring them back. The mines aren’t going to re-open. The affected people didn’t get to choose between retraining or keeping their current jobs. They had to choose between learning new marketable skills in a classroom or scrabbling through whatever remaining local jobs they could find.

We’re not there with truck driving yet, but to me it seems inevitable. I wouldn’t consider it as a brand new career worth starting today if my intent were to retire from it.

EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
I'm only arguing that it makes complete sense why people are resisting if someone is telling them otherwise. I would also cling to my livelihood if my alternative was losing my home, my healthcare, my stability. And I'd further be insulted by people offering me retraining programs that don't actually train me to a lateral career. I'm trying to practice some empathy, man.
EatingWithForks commented on California's Governor Vetoes State Ban on Driverless Trucks   wired.com/story/californi... · Posted by u/mattas
kstrauser · 2 years ago
But not as much as not retraining. Given the choice between a ship and a lifeboat, I’d take the ship. Choosing between a lifeboat and treading water, scoot over and hand me an oar.
EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
I'm arguing that retraining isn't really the lifeboat people are saying it is.

Just be upfront: removing jobs is drowning people. That's it. Don't comfort yourself with "retraining" programs like they mean anything. They don't. Acting like you're giving them an oar is just insulting them on top of taking their livelihoods, so I understand the anger.

EatingWithForks commented on California's Governor Vetoes State Ban on Driverless Trucks   wired.com/story/californi... · Posted by u/mattas
grecy · 2 years ago
For sure, but I wonder what you (or anyone) is going to do about it.

Eventually, you simply have to go to work for a roof over your head, food and healthcare.

It doesn't really matter if you like it or not. If you current job ceases to exist you will get another job, or you will die.

EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
Yes, I'm just pointing out the retraining isn't actually the real alternative people think it is. It's directly lowering the quality of life and destroying the economic future of an entire industry's worth of people and all their families/dependents. This is important to deal with as it is, not with some bs "well we offered them retraining!" as if that means anything.
EatingWithForks commented on California's Governor Vetoes State Ban on Driverless Trucks   wired.com/story/californi... · Posted by u/mattas
kstrauser · 2 years ago
I agree, if we can get them into other jobs. So many other times we've seen workers who flat-out refused to participate in retraining because politicians talked them out of it. I'm specifically thinking of coal miners who believed the lie that their jobs were coming back, and based on that turned away free education offers that would have given them modern-world skills.
EatingWithForks · 2 years ago
Gonna be honest: if someone told me my tech job had been replaced with all its benefits (wfh! office stipend!) and now I have to retrain as a plumber, including back to the shitty apprenticeship system for low pay and low benefits (starting from the bottom again) I would also get really damn upset and resist that. There will be a lot of tooth gnashing on my end even if you pay for my apprenticeship and initial training, I'm still significantly worse off for the literal rest of my whole life.

u/EatingWithForks

KarmaCake day980May 1, 2023View Original