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modeless · 11 years ago
I tried one at Maker Faire. I was worried that the press photos were overselling the legibility of the screen, but in person it looks just as good as in the photos, and the animations are cool. I've been using a Moto 360 since release, so here are my thoughts:

* Pebble Time can't match the saturated colors of the Moto 360's screen indoors; however always-on and sunlight readability are far more important. I definitely prefer the Pebble Time screen for a watch.

* 7 day battery life: Don't care. I don't sleep with my watch on and with wireless or magnetic charging it's not a hassle to charge nightly.

* The Moto 360 touchscreen is slow and unreliable. I much prefer the Pebble's physical buttons.

* I prefer the Pebble's vibration motor to the Moto 360's.

* I find the Moto 360's voice commands to be mostly useless. My phone has always-on voice activation and it's faster and more reliable to talk directly to my phone even while it's still in my pocket. I wouldn't miss this feature switching to Pebble Time.

* I still prefer the Moto 360's design over any other smartwatch including Pebble Time. Most people assume it's an Apple Watch. That said, I think the Pebble Time looks reasonably good. Certainly better than any of the square Android Wear watches.

GuiA · 11 years ago
Have you owned an original Pebble, and if so can you comment on the vibration motor in the new Pebble compared to the old one?

I owned an original Pebble for a while, and the vibration motor was absolutely awful. It felt bad on the wrist, and it was very audible. In quiet meetings, people would hear it and it would make me look like an idiot with a childish toy. I stopped using the Pebble after a week or two for a number of reasons, but this was the main one.

BinaryIdiot · 11 years ago
This is my question as well; I do enjoy my original Pebble but end up turning notifications off half the times because it's WAY too audible so everyone near me hears each notification I get (and with work using Google Hangouts sometimes I get far, far too many notifications in quick succession).

If the Pebble Time has a better, lighter vibration (or better yet adjustable; the original Pebble's vibration as an alarm clock is perfect but not at all for notifications). then I may be tempted to pick one up.

modeless · 11 years ago
I do own an original Pebble, but haven't worn it for a long enough time that I don't remember how the vibration compares.
wvenable · 11 years ago
The Pebble Time's vibration is much more subtle (but still strong). A big improvement over the original Pebble.
driverdan · 11 years ago
I have an original Pebble and love how powerful the vibration is. I never miss an alert and it wakes me up every time.
yellowapple · 11 years ago
> 7 day battery life: Don't care. I don't sleep with my watch on and with wireless or magnetic charging it's not a hassle to charge nightly.

For me, that's actually a pretty big selling point for a variety of reasons (namely that charging isn't always going to be a possibility - i.e. if I'm out hiking/camping or otherwise "off the grid").

KeytarHero · 11 years ago
> I still prefer the Moto 360's design over any other smartwatch including Pebble Time. Most people assume it's an Apple Watch.

Given that people are thinking a round watch is an Apple Watch, I'm not sure that says much about their judgment in watch design.

modeless · 11 years ago
I think that a person who hasn't memorized the shape of the Apple Watch can still have a valid opinion about design.
azernik · 11 years ago
All it says is that they assume Apple's is the coolest.
bigtunacan · 11 years ago
I have the Moto 360 as well, and on most of your points I agree.

On the 7 day battery life though... The Moto 360 battery life sucks. I can't make it from sun-up until bed time without the Moto 360 dying if I try to actually use it for anything useful such as using the music streaming or even the stopwatch when I'm at the gym.

I have had to revert to using my iPod for music at the gym and an old fashioned stop watch.

As the health aspects of the Moto 360 were the primary selling points to me; it's really been a waste of money.

angryasian · 11 years ago
Have you received latest updates. I would say I'm on the higher end of usage with all notifications from personal and work emails, messaging services, calendar updates.. and mine easily lasts a day and half. I don't need always on, as its really pointless for me to have it on, if I'm not actively looking at it.
acgourley · 11 years ago
Most people think my first gen pebble is an apple watch, too.
bottled_poe · 11 years ago
This is an advantage of advertising when the competition doesn't.
madez · 11 years ago
I backed the Pebble Time on kickstarter but recently canceled the pledge due to privacy concerns.

Why do companies think that it is okay that devices, that customers carry all day long on them, phone anywhere unless they are told so and controlled by the user?

By default, I do not agree to collection of any data about me, not even anonymised.

I'm increasingly concerned that it seems that hardware companies try not to only sell the product, but also to never give up control of the individual products. What can we do about that?

I'd happily buy an even considerately more expensive iPhone, if it'd only put me in ultimate control.

wfvq45zf · 11 years ago
Gadgetbridge is a FOSS companion app for Pebble and other devices that seeks to put users back in control of their data. I don't believe it has Pebble Time support yet,and the feature set is limited, but it looks promising. https://fossdroid.com/a/gadgetbridge.html
madez · 11 years ago
Thanks for pointing out Gadgetbridge. While informing myself before deciding to cancel my order of the Pebble Time I already found it. However, afaik the Pebble Time is not supported by Gadgetbridge and I didn't want to buy a product I maybe can't use.
click170 · 11 years ago
Thank you for sharing this! I had no idea it existed before, but this sounds like exactly what I've been looking for.

I want to find out if it needs to make the same requests to zalew.net.pl as the official Android app in order to configure my Pebble!

apricot · 11 years ago
I agree. It worries me that finding out exactly what data your device or software shares with whom is very hard to find nowadays. You buy something without really knowing what it does.

This is not really new (how many people, even today, are aware that most color laser printers embed their serial number on every page they print?) but the rise of ubiquitous mobile computers equipped with a camera, an always-on microphone and permanent net access raises grave privacy concerns.

delecti · 11 years ago
Can you elaborate on what data you think Pebble is collecting?
madez · 11 years ago
Yes, sure. From http://pages.getpebble.com/pages/privacy I quote

    We may collect information such as occupation, language, zip code,
    area code, unique device identifier, location, and the time zone
    where a Pebble product is used.
and

    We also may collect information regarding customer activities on
    our website, Pebble Android App, Pebble iOS App, account.getpebble.com
    services and from our other products and services.
and

    We may collect smartphone device-specific logs which, for example,
    include your hardware model, operating system version and unique
    device identifiers.
I'm not okay with any of these rules.

madez · 11 years ago
Dear downvoters, without articulated critique I don't know what to improve.
coldpie · 11 years ago
Ignore any votes, up or down, in the first half-hour. They tend to balance out over time, as they have here.
carsongross · 11 years ago
I'm very glad to see pebble stay in the game. That said, this is a pretty tough watch for a traditional watch guy to look at.

I hope that someone really nails the circular smart watch and embraces the rotating bezel as an input modality, like the 1st gen ipods or, more recently, Nest. I would love that, coupled with a traditional diver or tool watch look:

http://cdn.monochrome-watches.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04...

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/75/b2/bf/75b2bf2d9...

Maybe motorola will get it, but I wonder if their design sensibilities are too modern...

benswieskowski · 11 years ago
You should check out Olio Devices. I think it's clearly the best designed of all connected watches.

https://www.oliodevices.com/

sirkneeland · 11 years ago
Samsung (of all companies) is apparently working on that...
BinaryIdiot · 11 years ago
It's a really safe bet that if there is a gadget / electronic category Samsung is working on at least 3 products in it. Sometimes that's good, sometimes not so much.
r0naa · 11 years ago
I really admire Pebble for they are the only company that is truly trying to make an accessible and efficient product.

I don't believe that people will buy a computer, a smartphone, a tablet and a watch. Assuming that each of these devices remain widely used (as it is the case today) I think that people will make a choice to reach a balance.

In that scenario, it is easy to see how an expensive watch that replicates smartphone's functionalities would be a commercial failure.

Pebble on the contrary opted for having a finite, and comparatively small, set of functionalities but excel at those. Their choice of limiting the watch functionalities has two obvious positive effects:

- It keeps the price low. I want a product that will last, that I can forget about (great battery life comes into play) and that does not cost an arm. I can't afford (or don't want) to pay for both a smartwatch and a smartphone costing >200$USD. In comparison I got my Pebble for 50$USD and it's working great.

- It eliminates the redundancy that occurs between smartphones/smartwatches. Instead you have a "central nervous system": your phone and an assistant that makes interacting with that CNS easier: the watch.

I would like to see some drastic improvements in the design though. It's kind of terrible and remind the early 2000s with the ave of Palm Pilots etc... Also, it would be great to improve the sensors so I can use my Pebble as a monitor of health (and my sleep!).

I would actually spend money on a product that would monitor my sleep, bpms and wake me up in the morning at the "best" time.

sdrothrock · 11 years ago
> I can't afford (or don't want) to pay for both a smartwatch and a smartphone costing >200$USD. In comparison I got my Pebble for 50$USD and it's working great.

I'm not targeting you in particular, but you brought up something that confuses me when people who say this about a smartwatch.

It seems like a lot of people who are getting into smartwatches aren't too aware of traditional watch geekery and prices; $200 for a watch is relatively cheap as far as nice watches go.

I'm not denying that if you want something functional, a cheaper price is always nicer -- just offering up for consideration that watches are traditionally a pretty expensive accessory. :)

archagon · 11 years ago
Smartwatch buyers tend to look at them as gadgets rather than fashion accessories, by which measure, yes, they're quite expensive.
untog · 11 years ago
They can last a lifetime (or more!) though. Smartwatches will be out of date within years.
nilkn · 11 years ago
> I don't believe that people will buy a computer, a smartphone, a tablet and a watch. Assuming that each of these devices remain widely used (as it is the case today) I think that people will make a choice to reach a balance.

> In that scenario, it is easy to see how an expensive watch that replicates smartphone's functionalities would be a commercial failure.

I've thought about this problem for me personally and agree that I definitely don't want all four. I'm fine with three of them, though. In my case, I've decided I'd actually much prefer a smartwatch over a tablet, in the sense that I think a tablet is actually more redundant on top of the phone than a smartwatch. I've actually completely lost interest in tablets over the last year or so.

I had a Moto 360 and there were moments when I felt a glimpse of the genius of a smartwatch. The rest of the time I was frustrated with the incredibly laggy interface, the pixelated screen, the flat tire at the bottom, the general massiveness of the watch, and the extreme unreliability of the fitness tracking options. From what I've seen of the Apple Watch, it's a huge step forward in terms of basic quality, both hardware and software, but I'd have to switch to an iPhone to use one.

The Pebble Time has a quirky appearance, but it looks great in terms of usability and software quality, so I'm definitely excited to try one when I can get my hands on one.

sdrothrock · 11 years ago
> I had a Moto 360 and there were moments when I felt a glimpse of the genius of a smartwatch.

Adding a personal anecdote to this. The deployant strap on my 360 broke last week, so I had a week of enforced vacation from the 360 to compare before-after and see how much I really liked it. Too tell the truth, I'd actually been feeling kind of "meh" about the 360 and wondering why I really needed it, if I even did.

Here are some things I noticed:

1. Phantom leg vibrations stopped when I got the 360, but once I stopped using the 360, they came back with a vengeance. (I've never had phantom wrist vibrations.)

2. It really is a lot more disruptive to pull out my phone at dinner etc. if I get a call or e-mail from work (devops). The 360 lets me judge things quickly and relatively unobtrusively. Related, I also missed a lot of notifications for people trying to get ahold of me by chat (which I encourage people to do instead of phoning, since I have profound hearing loss).

3. The Fitbit HR (I wear it on my other wrist) is way better for telling time. I can hit the button and see the time faster than the 360 -- this has to change in some way for the 360 to be a smartWATCH.

4. I really missed being able to reply quickly by voice on the go when I wasn't able to pull out my phone.

calgoo · 11 years ago
>I've thought about this problem for me personally and agree that I definitely don't want all four. I'm fine with three of them, though. In my case, I've decided I'd actually much prefer a smartwatch over a tablet, in the sense that I think a tablet is actually more redundant on top of the phone than a smartwatch. I've actually completely lost interest in tablets over the last year or so.

I actually feel the total opposite... I hate using my phone, and love being on the tablet. At the moment my phone is basically used for WhatsApp and an occasional map search on the go.

I would prefer to have a 4G hub that connects all my devices to the internet. Even better, make the hub intelligent and move all the processing power to it. Then make the tablet and phone act as a screen and it would be perfect :)

formatjam · 11 years ago
> In that scenario, it is easy to see how an expensive watch that replicates smartphone's functionalities would be a commercial failure.

I think in the case of watch and luxury products, this is different. Buyers don't buy watch for the functionality of checking time, but the design, status symbol and other values from luxury goods.

r0naa · 11 years ago
> Buyers don't buy watch for the functionality of checking time, but the design, status symbol and other values from luxury goods.

Well not all of them! Look at the wrists of the people around you. When I do so, I mostly see regular watches. Sometimes some of them have a fancy design but they all share common characteristics which are:

* easy of use; doing one job very well; inexpensiveness

The watch industry is so well established that almost anyone can afford an aesthetically pleasing watch at a reasonable price.

I don't think that people will spend so much money on wearables that are so redundant with their already complicated smartphones.

On the other hand, Pebble have a good product that does a great job at making everyday tasks easier. It's not a smartphone on my wrist, it's just an aid.. exactly like my old watch used to be. As I said above, the watch is solid and pretty inexpensive. IMHO I think that the only missing pieces are: variety of designs available, better embedded technologies.

I will address the case of the "watch connoisseur" in the following paragraph. I will assume (safely?) that they although those consumes have a huge buying power, they are the minority.

They buy watch for their personal pleasure and because they appreciate the often mind-blowing technologies that they embed. A high-end watch is more than a useful device, it is a piece of human craftsmanship. It is both a symbol and a status that has prestige. See Patek Phillipe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGPjFFMD3c0

I don't think that watch luxury brands are threaten by the ave of wearable devices and I would definitely not consider Apple as luxury company. To me they are kind of in the worst position: not expensive/complicated enough to appeal to the collectors and not cheap enough to appeal to "most" people unless they are already loyal to the brand.

kriro · 11 years ago
I own an Android phone and recently bought an LG Urbane Silver (leather) because it was the first smartwatch I saw that looked decent (subjective obviously) and can be worn with a suit on occasion. I didn't own a watch for ~10 years now and felt it was time to get one and more or less randomly decided to get a smartwatch...because why not. I was very sceptical and didn't expect much. If you just list the stuff I do with it it is indeed not much but I already rank it as an excellent purchase. Here's what I use most often (in case anyone is on the fence):

- Tell the time: No need for a smartwatch but it's still great to be able to leave the cell in the pocket

- Don't miss calls: I always have my phone on no sound/just vibrate and tended to miss a lot of calls. Fixed for good now

- Quickly check Mail/IM: To see if there's something important to answer to. I feel a lot calmer because I always felt the urge to check my phone constantly. I now glance at the watch every now and then and feel a lot less "addicted". I actually use the quick reply stuff a lot for IM, too.

- Maps navigation: I am travelling a good bit and usually ran around the cities with my cell looking all touristy. Maps on the watch is a lot more discrete

- Timer: I use it as my Pomodoro Technique timer since my old one can't be used in a multiperson office without annoying people

Battery time is ~2 day, 1.5 when I use it more. As long as it stays above 1 day I'm fine because I take off the watch when I sleep and just put it on the charger.

p.s.: the Pebbles never did it for me style wise but kudos for them for pushing smartwatches further along.

emsy · 11 years ago
I love my original Pebble. I even like the cheap look, it seems like it's referring to an 80s Casio watch, without copying it (I don't quite like the Time's look but it's ok). But the main reason I love the Pebble is because it gives me freedom. Freedom from having to carry a charger when I'm 3 days away. Freedom from convoluted apps that already annoy me on my smartphone. But mainly Freedom to switch the mobile OS without my smartwatch becoming a useless chunk. When I first heard that the Time will feature voice functionality, I was excited. It's unfortunate that it can't have a deeper integration into the systems. I think the main limitation of the Pebble is not the look nor the price but that Pebble is neither Google nor Apple.
rev_bird · 11 years ago
Freedom #3 (OS-independent operation) is a really interesting observation, but the first two freedoms seem like they'd be solved with... a regular watch?
emsy · 11 years ago
I still want the main benefit of a smartwatch: not having to pull out the smartphone to see what my smartphone has to tell me (I have very few notifications, but there are some occasions where immediate response is necessary).
hyperpallium · 11 years ago
Smart watches are an accessory (like headphones), always an add-on, never a general-purpose computer. The UI is too limited. But people pay a lot for headphones (e.g. Beats by Dre, which Apple acquired). They'll pay even more for a fancy watch.

The terrible problem for Pebble is they are an add-on to platforms owned by others, who now have their own add-ons. Historically, this doesn't end well for the pebbles of this world - even though they were first and did everything right - but it might.

I think they should be able to integrate with Google Gear, and MS would be receptive too.

ohitsdom · 11 years ago
I think the headphone comparison is really weak. If you want to listen to any audio, in most settings you need headphones (at work, in public spaces).

Smart watches do not fill that void. They may make certain tasks easier, but there are other available options (like just pulling out your phone to look at the time or to see who is calling).

rev_bird · 11 years ago
If you're wearing Beats (or any expensive headphone setup), it's not just because you need to listen to audio in a library or something -- you've made a decision to spend a considerable amount of money on a product with functionality that could be replaced, on most levels, for < 10 bucks.

I'm not saying there isn't a reason to buy quality headphones -- I spent like $80 on mine and love them -- but "nice headphones with noise-cancelling and extra padding and increased fidelity" doesn't seem like an outlandish comparison to "watch with extra stuff and it tells you the weather."

nahiluhmot · 11 years ago
I'm curious, do people generally feel that smartwatches are the way of the future? I can't really imagine that a device with a screen the size of a thumbnail outperforming a smartphone for common use cases (scrolling through Twitter, reading emails, browsing the web, etc.) Although at-a-glance notifications and health/sleep tracking are potentially desirable features, it seems that the price will need to drop significantly before anybody besides hobbyists will adopt these.
djur · 11 years ago
I recently started using a Pebble (the classic model). I don't traditionally wear watches. The core functionality -- being notified of text messages and phone calls with enough information to make a decision on whether I want to respond immediately -- is pretty much all I care about, although I have actually found myself surprised by how much I like being able to glance at the time without pulling out my phone.

The Pebble doesn't even support things like reading emails, browsing the web, etc. and I wouldn't want to use such a feature. The battery life is good and it charges quickly -- mentally it's more in line with my Kindle than my phone as far as how much I think about its charge. If it runs out of batteries it isn't the end of the world anyway.

My goal in getting it was to spend less time fiddling with my phone and concentrating more on life around me, while still not missing situations where a friend or loved one needs to get in touch urgently. A secondary motivation was to miss fewer calls (I am somewhat hard of hearing & frequently keep my phone's ringer off anyway for professional reasons, and I do not always feel my phone vibrate through my jeans). The Pebble has been very successful in that regard and I consider the $99 well spent.

My hope is that even though Pebble is pursuing a somewhat higher-end market with the Pebble Time that they (or some other manufacturer) continue to produce a line of cheap, durable, minimalist smartwatches. I hope to be able to replace this one if it gets seriously damaged or becomes completely obsolete (if Bluetooth goes the way of the dodo, I guess). I have no interest in higher-end smartwatches.

yellowapple · 11 years ago
I think trying to use a smartwatch in lieu of a smartphone is the wrong approach, even if this is the approach the Apple Watch and Android Wear devices are leaning toward. Pebble's approach with Time (and, indeed, with its previous devices) is refreshing in this regard, since the focus is on amplifying the strengths of smartwatches instead of trying to work around their weaknesses relative to smartphones.
wj · 11 years ago
There is a tv show called Psycho Pass which is set in the near future. I bring it up as it has a wristwatch in it where you press a button on it and then it projects a larger screen out of it (maybe 6"x4") about six inches away from the wrist. Sensors then allow you to interact with the screen.

So, I was thinking that the Apple phone would be something like this projected keyboard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projection_keyboard) but as a touchscreen that is suspended in mid air.

No idea what the tech behind that could be. Closest I could come up with is the watch shooting out a fog when you want the virtual display.

I definitely thought the Apple Watch would be a little bit further ahead of other smartwatches than it is. I thought it would be to other smartwatches what the iPhone was to other smartphones at the time.

clarky07 · 11 years ago
The core functionality of notifications and at a glance complications really is great. If you are into fitness that's a big bonus. Depending on how much you like watches, the price may or may not be excessive.

While the price may need to come down for mass adoption, anyone that is already into watches shouldn't have too much trouble with the current prices. If you can afford it, they are totally worth it, IMO. (I had the original Pebble, liked it, and now I have an Apple Watch, and I'm also happy with it.)

bluthru · 11 years ago
Almost everyone will have a smart watch in the future for security and health reasons.

Parents will be able to know where their kids are at all times. Someone being attacked could shout into their watch that they need 911 and the GPS will route help to the scene. Health monitoring will become much more sophisticated. Women will enjoy going out without worrying about putting a phone in a pocket that doesn't exist. The heating and cooling of your car, office, and home will adjust to your body's temperature. Society will go cashless.

The biggest potential in smartwatches doesn't depend much on the screen interaction.