Ah was coming to point that out. SP, Mexico City, and a few other mega cities in LatAm are already relying on private helicopters for the ultra-rich to get around the cities. They probably have an advantage over any US market for these EVTOL vehicles as the in-city aerial regulations are already established to support this. FAA is more focused on airplanes than helicopters in the US
This also happens in the US, but it's mostly tourists rather than the super rich. In NYC we have the advocacy group "Stop The Chop" that is attempting to reduce the number of helicopter flights over expensive neighborhoods. I think it is doomed to fail; air traffic is regulated by the federal government, and I don't think they care at all. The best path is to just buy the heliport and shut it down, but I don't think anyone wants to spend that much money on it. ("If we can get it for free, yeah, screw anyone that wants to fly over our property. If we have to pay, honestly it's not that annoying." Don't tell them I said that.)
Embraer makes some very interesting mid-sized commercial planes. This piece is light on details and the price range seems crazy optimistic - can you believe you would only pay 2x or 3x what an Uber charges to fly over a city? Nevertheless, seems like a promising concept.
That remains to be proven. In theory, maintenance might eventually be cheaper. But there are still a lot of mechanical parts which will require periodic manual inspection every certain number of cycles or operating hours. Electric motors are simpler than combustion engines but eVTOL designs tend to have a lot of them for control and reliability. Crew expenses will be similar (autonomous operation with passengers is still many years away). Electricity may be cheaper than fuel, but recharging times will be critical for profitable operation.
I was at a talk given by the president of Embraer-X (that's an Embraer subsidiary that looks into these riskier ventures), and he got into the details of how they validated their business plan of using these vehicles for urban transportation.
They offered helicopter rides to one of Rio's major airports and charged R$100 per passenger (according to him, that's an accurate estimate of future prices once they make their eVTOL) at a loss just to see if there was demand. They got booked the entire year in advance.
Brazilian guy here: Embraer is in deep trouble ever since before the pandemic, when their merge deal with Boeing went south after the Max debacle. I would really like to believe otherwise, but I can only see this as vaporware intended to pump the stock price of Embraer. Flying taxi drones as an economic viable alternative, on a 3rd world country nonetheless, is a hard nut to crack. If even their helicopter taxi venture proof of concept was not being profitable, using a proven technology. How in hell will they make this drone experiment be profitable then?
As they say in there, "Brazil is the country of the future and it will always be, never the country of the present". This taxi looks like a Brazilian future: always coming, never present.
Embraer is skilled, but the manufacturing industry in Brazil is in decline. Besides, most of the money in the country is flowing into smaller towns in the countryside, following agricultural boom. Not too much need for helicopter taxis in there.
Disclaimer: I am a "viralata", a Brazilian that ran away from the country.
Really honestly, I could tell that before I finished your second paragraph. I see people around the world criticizing their own countries quite often, but afaik only Brazilians take the criticism to such a self-depreciative level.
Am Brazilian, can personally confirm. I used to do that too. I actually left the country with the explicit goal of shedding my Brazilian identity and becoming someone else entirely.
I think Brazil suffers from being a country where some segments of the population can’t find a relatable national identity. I feel very strongly about my state identity (I’m a gaucho from Rio Grande do Sul) to the point I’d probably support secession if that was a serious possibility, but I’ve never felt anything positive about being Brazilian.
Funny enough, 10 years later and now a US citizen, I don’t speak so negatively about Brazil anymore. Turns that that over time I found out I’m a bit more Brazilian than I thought, despite former efforts to not be one. Also, there are things I miss about living there, at least compared to living in the US. If it wasn’t for the still insane crime rates, I’d consider moving back for a season.
"Flying Taxi" doesn't work. Either you try to do it cheaply and regularly kill riders because your underpaid maintenance staff missed a step somewhere, or you quadruple check every speck of dust to ensure people don't regularly and predictably die but then a single ride is "I'm too rich for public transport" price.
What possible difference could change that status quo? We have commodity helicopters right now, but very few people commute anywhere by helicopter.
It's a difference if it's some random startup looking to part incompetent investors from their funds (there have been way too many of these), legit startups, or a classic aviation player.
In any case, when talking about startups, both Lilium Aviation (Munich) and Volocopter (Bruchsal) got actually flying prototypes into the air [1], and they're led by actually competent former Airbus people.
Readit News
https://www.nytimes.com/2000/02/15/world/sao-paulo-journal-r...
Talk about an underpriced externality.
They probably know where the costs are. Maintenance and fuel I guess... And electric VTOLs are far cheaper on these two.
They offered helicopter rides to one of Rio's major airports and charged R$100 per passenger (according to him, that's an accurate estimate of future prices once they make their eVTOL) at a loss just to see if there was demand. They got booked the entire year in advance.
Rio de Janiero is a bit larger than Moscow, Paris and Guangzhou yet each have at least 5x the metro infrastructure.
https://flyflapper.com/stories/uber-air/
As they say in there, "Brazil is the country of the future and it will always be, never the country of the present". This taxi looks like a Brazilian future: always coming, never present.
Embraer is skilled, but the manufacturing industry in Brazil is in decline. Besides, most of the money in the country is flowing into smaller towns in the countryside, following agricultural boom. Not too much need for helicopter taxis in there.
Disclaimer: I am a "viralata", a Brazilian that ran away from the country.
Yes, indeed. You are basically doubting that Embraer can manufacture and sell airplanes.
I would understand some doubts about the technology or overall acceptance. But plainly doubting their capacity to build and sell things is ridiculous.
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That's an understatement, they're a top 3 if not even top 2 aircraft manufacturer in the world.
I'm not entirely convinced in the electric taxi model's financial viability, but Embraer are certainly capable of manufacturing them.
Really honestly, I could tell that before I finished your second paragraph. I see people around the world criticizing their own countries quite often, but afaik only Brazilians take the criticism to such a self-depreciative level.
I think Brazil suffers from being a country where some segments of the population can’t find a relatable national identity. I feel very strongly about my state identity (I’m a gaucho from Rio Grande do Sul) to the point I’d probably support secession if that was a serious possibility, but I’ve never felt anything positive about being Brazilian.
Funny enough, 10 years later and now a US citizen, I don’t speak so negatively about Brazil anymore. Turns that that over time I found out I’m a bit more Brazilian than I thought, despite former efforts to not be one. Also, there are things I miss about living there, at least compared to living in the US. If it wasn’t for the still insane crime rates, I’d consider moving back for a season.
What possible difference could change that status quo? We have commodity helicopters right now, but very few people commute anywhere by helicopter.
In any case, when talking about startups, both Lilium Aviation (Munich) and Volocopter (Bruchsal) got actually flying prototypes into the air [1], and they're led by actually competent former Airbus people.
[1] https://www.sueddeutsche.de/projekte/artikel/wirtschaft/flug...
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