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Posted by u/solididiot 4 years ago
Ask HN: How do you manage or avoid meltdowns?
Being a SW Eng I spent hours on a chair. In home-office. COVID lockdowns made this worse. Added extra stress due to bad future outlook and a lack of direction in my career plus dozens of other blockers that navigating gets more difficult as I grow older.

Anyway. The point of the matter is that I crack and meltdown quite often. And that makes my problems multiply because I then have to deal with apologies etc.

How do you deal with meltdowns? How do you calm yourself down? I'm not talking about being a Buddha (I'm as far away from that as I could be unfortunately). I'm talking about doing the bare minimum so that I don't cause myself and the people around me extra problems.

For the most part I have managed to keep this away from my (shitty) job so it has not affected my (dead in the water) career. But it is taking a toll on my family relations and I hate me for that.

No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

Any practical tips that work on you are highly appreciated.

For context I'm 45 yrs old, male, relatively new dad in a backwater EU country.

TIA

ivraatiems · 4 years ago
Given the impact of these symptoms on your life, you have a problem that's likely beyond the ability of the well-intentioned people on the internet to fully help.

Refusing to seek psychotherapy for this situation is like refusing to fix a hole in your tailpipe because you don't trust mechanics. Eventually, it'll rust through and fall off, and you won't have a choice but to fix it... for more money and time.

That is to say, your option is to seek professional help now, while this is a solvable problem, or to wait until things get worse and you don't have a choice. Have you considered what will happen if and when your "meltdowns" escalate to the point where you can't apologize your way out of them? Or, worse, where you are not able to pull yourself out?

You should consider seeking a psychiatrist or physician with experience prescribing psychiatric medication, but be ready for them to refuse to help you unless you commit to talk therapy of some kind also. Be aware that there are dozens of therapeutic modalities that are all different - your previous experience with therapy is unlikely to cover them all. You might have to go through multiple professional people before you find one that will fit what you need.

ntlk · 4 years ago
This is one of the more useful bits of advice here in my opinion.

Things like exercise, sleep, eating well etc. could go some way to coping better with the underlying issue, but by themselves are unlikely to address what’s actually going on.

The situation described suggests that feelings are not being managed very well. There could be lots of reasons why, but given the severity any quick fixes from random people on the internet are unlikely to result in sustained improvement.

ystad · 4 years ago
fwiw +1 good advice.

You need to trust without any reservations that therapy or counseling is going to help.

You might not gel well with a specific therapist, and there is a choice to get a different therapist or therapy until one works for you.

Also, this takes time

choeger · 4 years ago
> relatively new dad

This is probably a core reason for your problem. I would bet that you find it difficult to adapt to the new normal. You now have less time to yourself and many more constraints to deal with. That's just super stressful. Here's my advice as a not-so-new father:

1. It's OK to be stressed. Don't stress out over your stress level (Meta Stress).

2. Things will get better.

3. Take some you-time. Do whatever helps you. Cardio is an excellent idea, like jogging through brisk winter air. But make sure to communicate and coordinate this time with your SO.

4. Get your priorities straight. Once I made the conscious decision that kids are more important than work, I could let go of work projects easily when a child became sick and needed care. Communicate this openly with coworkers and bosses.

5. Plan for vacations and other breaks auch that you have one every two months. For instance, maybe the kid(s) likes a weekend with the grandparents? Or the family goes to the zoo every once in a while? This will help to reset your stress level.

luxurytent · 4 years ago
Yes. Being a new parent — exacerbated by this current normal — is incredibly difficult. My wife and I have spent the past year focusing much of our energy on ourselves (after the kids, work, etc)

That dedicated time we have where we do what we need just for us has turned our year around; I run 5km a day, she goes to the gym to lift weights 3x a week. It took adjustment in our schedules and the time in the day is tight, but it’s oh so worth it.

We have many other priorities, like renovating the garage or reorganizing the living room, but we’ve decided that’s lower on the priority — with two young kids 2021 was not just about survival, but for us as a family to thrive.

Wishing OP the best!

thejackgoode · 4 years ago
> No phychotherapy please. I won't go near their arrogance.

No professional psychotherapist can afford to be arrogant, you might have gotten unlucky with your experience so far. They are equipped to answer exactly such questions. Psychodynamic approaches, for example, are something you might want to look into.

muzani · 4 years ago
Yup, arrogance is a symptom of incompetency. People are loudest about the things they are unsure about. We see it all the time in our line of work - beginners are the most arrogant. But it applies to doctors, lawyers, and psychotherapists too.
Ensorceled · 4 years ago
Yes, you will encounter arrogance in all those professions. Just as often a professional will be called "arrogant" for telling us what we don't want to hear.

My dad's cardiologist is one of the best doctors I've ever encountered. His online ratings are all over the place and MOST of the low ranking patients were calling him "arrogant" and "terrible bedside manner".

johnmarcus · 4 years ago
And let's not forget, it also applies to patients as well.
mdip · 4 years ago

  > No psychotherapy please.  I won't go near their arrogance.
I felt this way a while back. I realize, now, that it was my arrogance that was the problem with that situation -- coupled with a small number of bad experiences with psychologists[0]. Finding one that works for you is difficult, and it took me quite some time, but the value of having a professional "disinterested third-party" decode the workings of your mind is impossible to replicate alone.

Consider that the thing responsible for diagnosing your problems is the exact thing with the problem. Your brain has a way of lying to you, making things seem smaller/less impactful than they are. Talking to a professional about it can reveal things to you which you can't see with the blinders that your brain puts up. It doesn't have to mean "turning your brain off and blindly listening to everything you're told" -- it means listening for something this third-party is telling you that you may not agree with, but perhaps -- they're seeing something you're not and you should evaluate whether or not they might be on to something.

If you are unwilling to see a psychotherapist, find a friend that you trust deeply enough with this problem and ask them, directly, "What do you think I'm doing wrong, here?" or "What do I need to start doing differently?"

[0] Maybe it's just where I live but it seems every psychologist in the field got there because they had years of psychotherapy of their own. It's almost similar to how many who work in drug rehabilitation are former drug addicts, themselves. I'm not sure that it's bad, always, but I found myself speaking with people that seemed a lot less put together than myself.

clarge1120 · 4 years ago
Before I found a great car mechanic, I took my car to a couple of unethical and incompetent shops that would do things like spray-paint an old part and charge the customer for a replacement. I didn't trust auto mechanics for years.

I suppose psychotherapy is a skill that can be done well or done poorly. If done poorly it could cause great damage to people personally. Same could be said for any discipline that deals with intimate relationships.

mdip · 4 years ago
Completely agree!

And I had to pipe in to say I've had similar problems with mechanics -- though not as brazen as spray painting old parts, but frequent cases of being over-charged for things that weren't fixed, not honoring warranties for things that weren't fixed, and generally having a car that ... wasn't fixed.

Like my psychotherapist, I found an amazing car mechanic. He's made a mistake or two over the years, but every single time it happened, he resolved it beyond my satisfaction. Honestly, kind of worried about how old the guy is getting who owns the shop and hoping he leaves it to someone with the same high ethical standards.

Most of my bad experiences with therapists were simply people that couldn't relate to my circumstances in a manner that they could provide advice/actions that I could use rather than people doing actual harm, but I could see that as a possibility if I had stayed for too long.

noduerme · 4 years ago
Having been here a lot of times.. Fuck the client or the boss, it's important to me that I put my best work forward. Even if it makes no difference to me financially. Even if their stupid company will go down in flames. Even if I don't want to wake up tomorrow and look at their piece of shit online store / dumbass genZ insta-sales emails / customer can't click button on iphone / server collapsed because Amazon EC2 West-1 .........

It's called fucking professionalism. So stop listening to the whining cohort and realize it's just doing a goddamn job.

Okay, that's my pitch to people who grew up in a military family.

On the other hand, consider yourself the bright spot in the day for everyone who has no fucking clue what's going on.

And it's 2022. I just raised my hourly rate from $200 to $250. Do the same. And find some good ways to spend that good energy you still have, racing in the street or playing in a band or throwing paint at a wall.

One day I realized.. ahem. Sorry. Today I woke up and reminded myself . Ahem. Every fucking day I work on a customer's code I need to remember it's a job, I'm doing it for the fucking money. Not to be a saint. Wake up. Set four hours. Make money. Write good code. Done? Great. Now I hope you know by now what you're going to do with the rest of your day. What is it?

It's soooo easy to slip into the hole where we feel like we finished the work and the day is done. Let's get a pizza and watch netflix. That, my friend, is a death spiral.

Just treat the work like work. [edit here:] Everyone I've ever worked for had no capacity to do what I do, but those motherfuckers went above and beyond to make me feel like my moral obligation and main mission in life was to solve their problems while they partied and slept.

Your main problem sounds like you don't know how to enjoy the other 16 hours of your day.

dotancohen · 4 years ago
I'd like to stress this:

  > On the other hand, consider yourself the bright spot in
  > the day for everyone who has no fucking clue what's going on.
You've put into words the way I live. No matter how upset or angry I am, no matter how much traffic or rain was on my drive, no matter how much code was lost, I try to be the thing that people in my life look forward to. Always make other people feel better after talking to you.

I kind of developed that after hearing "people never remember what you say or do, people remember how you made them feel". Even the cop who pulls me over gets a smile and a "good morning".

I think that if just half of people did this, we would live in such a nicer world. This is the definition of civilization that I like best.

noduerme · 4 years ago
Never thought that would be a pull quote, but now that you mention it, you can put it on my tombstone. Isn't that the best part of the day?

I love doing end-user customer service. I'm incredibly thankful for being shielded from it 99% of the time, and I'd run off into the woods if I wasn't. But I love when I get to talk to them and just walk them through something. It's like any interaction that gives me some thought. I have MAGA neighbors. I have antifa neighbors. (I live in Portland, so). You get to a point where everyone has the same problems, and the only way you can solve them is by being civil with one another. That is civilization.

[edit] Just to reply to the spirit of what you said... there's something very reassuring about just being civil and decent. Pleasant, clear, logical, respectful or doubtful of authority; making yourself a person with other people. This is the ultimate power we all have that can't be taken away by any state or any authority. Civilizing the savages has taken on other connotations, but you can't beat civility. Politesse.

noduerme · 4 years ago
After looking you up, I wonder how much of this particular attitude is related to being Jewish. I sometimes feel like I'm refracting my family's misfortune in the Holocaust by making myself either unavoidably useful and friendly, or else unassailably logical. Maybe I tip too well.
kstenerud · 4 years ago
Biologically, a big thing is exercise. Get plenty of it, because it helps regulate mood (a lot). Longish walks or runs also help you take a time-out, which is important from time to time. Sunlight might also play a factor depending on how susceptible you are.

Also, being a new parent is inherently stressful. It helps to be aware of that to give some perspective.

Career-wise, think about what kinds of things related to your line of work you actually enjoy doing, don't enjoy doing, and utterly hate doing. There are different kinds of companies and work cultures that increase or decrease these things. Right now is a good time for remote workers, so you have more choice than you did a year ago. Figure out what areas of work will maximise what you like and minimise what you hate, then think carefully about what kinds of interview questions you can ask a potential employer to see what you can realistically expect if you worked there. It's perfectly fine to say "Sorry, we won't be a good match" and move on. Just like in relationships, there are all kinds.

wavegeek · 4 years ago
Meltdowns are a common feature of the lives of Autistic people.

There are vast resources available from books to many good youtube videos.

Getting a formal assessment is fairly expensive but screening tests are free.

https://novopsych.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/Autism-S...

https://novopsych.com.au/assessments/diagnosis/autism-spectr...

https://www.aspietests.org/userdetails.php?target=raads/inde...

Mostly it is about managing your levels of stress and knowing your limits. And lots of good strategies rather than therapy. One thing I realized is I need a lot more sleep than I had been getting. And I need to ration social 'work' (that's how it feels - hard work).

Autistic people are very prone to trauma - basically they are hyperspensitive to many stiumuli and emotions - so there may be residual trauma to deal with. But there are multiple ways to do that.

smoyer · 4 years ago
You're too old to be having melt-downs and it's a bad example to set for your relatively new child. I think there are a couple clues in the description you've added above though. Sitting in a chair for hours is necessary as a software developer but that shouldn't mean sitting in one position. If you can't stand for part of your workday, at least change the position you're sitting in. The terms "shitty job" and "dead-in-the-water career" are a more pressing matter - your attitude is going to be pretty well correlated to your feelings about your job. If you can't simply change jobs, try to find a way to "make it new". One of my tricks is to "see it with new eyes" which can be practiced by driving through your town and imagining it's your first time there (I've seen things doing this that I'd simply never noticed before.) Another thing you can do is find ways to do your job that result in you learning new skills. Finally, when you're not working you should get away from your desk. Doing housework can be cathartic and getting some exercise will definitely help.
james_s_tayler · 4 years ago
>You're too old to be having melt-downs and it's a bad example to set for your relatively new child.

Sorry, but this just comes off as so ableist.