zeroclip (u/zeroclip)

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

dmitriid · 3 years ago

Funny how out of 8 points listed, all you've latched onto a single one.

Let me rewrite this on point in a single sentence "this ineffecient unenforceable bug-ridden fest that can only use the imaginary tokens can be run more efficiently from a single Raspberry Pi".

Does this help?

zeroclip · 3 years ago

I'm not sure you are replying in good faith.

But, you are still making the claim that a decentralized smart contract protocol would be better replaced with a centralized traditional database on a Raspberry Pi. We disagree.

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

dmitriid · 3 years ago

> Your point is that centralized financial services on sqlite is good, decentralized protocols on a blockchain is bad?

Where exactly in this comment did I say that: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33606218?

> If that is your point, it's a funny one to make in a thread about a CEX collapsing.

What's funny is inventing arguments for other people and valiantly fighting against them.

"Smart contracts" were mentioned as "other uses of crypto currency, as yet unaddressed". I addressed them. I couldn't even care less how you made the illogical leap from that to whatever you accuse me of.

zeroclip · 3 years ago

Uniswap is a good application of smart contracts. Your comments explicitly suggest that Uniswap would be better run on something like sqlite, which needs a centralized owner, which is functionally the same as replacing a DEX with a CEX.

> in every single case would be more efficient and better served by Visual Basic running on a single Raspberry Pi from a sqlite database

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

dmitriid · 3 years ago

> Do you really feel that Uniswap is better run with sqlite on a Raspberry Pi?

Literally everything I wrote applies to Uniswap.

> because somebody has to own and control that database and physical device.

You've missed the point completely.

zeroclip · 3 years ago

Your point is that centralized financial services on sqlite is good, decentralized protocols on a blockchain is bad? If that is your point, it's a funny one to make in a thread about a CEX collapsing.

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

dmitriid · 3 years ago

> smart contracts are a different think, unaddressed here

Let me address this, then:

- they are not smart

- they are not contracts

- they are programs written in esoteric programming languages running on world's slowest and most inefficient VM

- due to esoteric nature their own authors cannot find trivial bugs in their implementations that are exploited at scale which would make any real platform nonviable

- cannot be updated or reverted because blockchain

- have literally no use outside the virtual imaginary world of crypto

- have zero legal standing, and cannot be enforced

- in every single case would be more efficient and better served by Visual Basic running on a single Raspberry Pi from a sqlite database.

zeroclip · 3 years ago

Do you really feel that Uniswap is better run with sqlite on a Raspberry Pi? If so, you are advocating for putting your money into a CEX, because somebody has to own and control that database and physical device.

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

Nursie · 3 years ago

Great, you can point to some that haven't been hacked, exploited or just plain collapsed yet.

You said "day traders on FTX are learning first hand the value of DeFi", but DeFi is just as much of a shitshow as the rest and has had just as many collapses.

zeroclip · 3 years ago

Uniswap, AAVE, MakerDAO traders will disagree with you.

I am one of these people: I had funds locked into a CEX, was lucky to pull them out some days before turmoil but others not so lucky. During that time my DeFi holdings were fine. I would now rather take on protocol risk of something established and proven like Uniswap, instead of risking with an unregulated CEX.

zeroclip commented on FTX’s balance sheet was bad bloomberg.com/opinion/art... · Posted by u/latchkey

astrange · 3 years ago

Sometimes they do.

https://twitter.com/web3isgreat/status/1538546864542429184

https://twitter.com/web3isgreat/status/1539113641336872961

https://twitter.com/web3isgreat/status/1587956557274353667

Remember, programs are proofs of themselves, but that doesn't mean they provably do what you thought they did.

zeroclip · 3 years ago

Depends where you look. Solend and Uniswap have different risks, to use comparison AAPL and some new hot unknown tech stock have different risks. Uniswap does not have code to pause withdrawals, does not have a DAO or governance structure to change the contract.

Risk profile in Uniswap and established DeFi protocol is more transparent than FTX. You cannot verify and audit a CEX, you have to trust they are doing things right, or trust the third parties who audit them. If you are skeptical of Binance or Tether audits then you understand the want for open source DeFi.

zeroclip commented on FTX’s balance sheet was bad bloomberg.com/opinion/art... · Posted by u/latchkey

legitster · 3 years ago

I often joke that crypto has been run by gold bugs who were forced to "smoke the whole pack" on fiat currencies. So a lot of crypto is a nihilistic homage to federal reserve systems.

In that way, "DeFi" feels the same about the finance industry.

It was no secret that SBF hated traditional finance. And so I assume he refused to learn anything from it. But what he ended up creating was almost a hilarious parody of the financial system.

That's at least how I can square the circle about how someone who could criticize Lehman Brothers for letting themselves get overleveraged on shady asset classes could literally have negative 8 billion dollars in "Hidden, poorly internally labeled ‘fiat@’ account" and then publicly go to Twitter to say they have a "liquidity problem".

zeroclip · 3 years ago

> In that way, "DeFi" feels the same about the finance industry.

How? DeFi protocols are behaving predictably and not pausing user withdrawals or hiding billion dollar black holes in their balances.

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

bogomipz · 3 years ago

Could you elaborate on what exactly is the "protocol risk" in DEX?

zeroclip · 3 years ago

A protocol is just code, code can have bugs. Another risk is around governance. Some protocols use proxy contracts, so a single developer or team can upgrade them. But they can accidentally push out a bug in a new version. Other protocols like Uniswap opt for non-upgradeable contracts, users have to opt-in to the new version.

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

alasdair_ · 3 years ago

There is still the question of how to convert your crypto to actual spendable dollars again. Sure, uniswap will let you get another token but you still need an exchange to get dollars. This gets particularly important when, say, the giant scam that is Tether finally crashes and burns,

zeroclip · 3 years ago

Yes, a regulated centralized exchange is valuable for on and off ramp. All they would need to do is process user transactions, take a small fee, and not gamble with user funds. Regulators could do audits and keep consumers protected.

But regulators have failed to provide clear framework for exchanges in the US[1], so most CEXes are running off shore.

[1] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/11/op-ed-crypto-markets-need-re...

zeroclip commented on Crypto exchange AAX suspends withdrawals trends.aax.com/important-... · Posted by u/JumpCrisscross

dhruval · 3 years ago

Not super knowledgeable on this but Decentralized exchanges exist why are they not more widely used by the crypto community?

zeroclip · 3 years ago

They are widely used and process billions per day.[1]

There are other problems with DeFi: protocol risk, transaction fees, speed, UX. They are newer and less known than CEXes and most users who buy and hold crypto on FTX or BlockFi do not know how to use the blockchain. Most of these problems can be overcome, like see L2 development, but it will take some time.

[1] https://defillama.com/chain/Ethereum

u/zeroclip

KarmaCake day211August 24, 2022View Original