silver-arrow (u/silver-arrow)

silver-arrow commented on PLATO: An educational computer system from the '60s shaped the future (2023) arstechnica.com/gadgets/2... · Posted by u/rbanffy

silver-arrow · 8 months ago

I loved Plato on my TI-99/4A computer when I was a kid. I credit it with helping me become a much better student. When my oldest son was struggling in grammar school, 15 years ago, I got it running on the Mame emulator for him, and it turned him and then his sibling into excellent students!

I don't understand why there isn't an even better version of this in the modern age. A complete curriculum K-12 that is self-driven in a similar manner. Mostly the same methodology of mostly reading and images with quizzes after sections. Then a total category exam. Maybe scatter in short effective videos, but it should not be video centered!

silver-arrow commented on Htmx is part of the GitHub Accelerator htmx.org/posts/2023-06-06... · Posted by u/jjdeveloper

uxns · 2 years ago

Out of curiosity, I presume you were working on the frontend part using Clojurescript? Have you used some kind of wrappers around htmx or just a simple js interop was enough?

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

We moved away from ClojureScript entirely. We just run a plain ole java uberjar with the Clojure/ring/hiccup/Compojure spitting out the HTML with whatever htmx attributes and response headers we need. There are instances where we may need to sprinkle in some javascript for some extra dynamic things - which turns out to be very infrequent. Instead of sprinkling in the javascript, we have been using _hyperscript instead - love _hyperscript.

Yeah, so moving to htmx has allowed us to jettison ClojureScript which just entailed too many parts. As a matter of fact, before going more htmx with our projects, we had moved away from ClojureScript to React directly.

silver-arrow commented on Htmx is part of the GitHub Accelerator htmx.org/posts/2023-06-06... · Posted by u/jjdeveloper

recursivedoubts · 2 years ago

i definitely think there is room for multiple implementations

unpoly is higher level than htmx, with different design sensibilities and concepts like 'layers' (https://unpoly.com/up.layer) which is something that doesn't make sense from htmx's "just extend HTML" perspective

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

Exactly! I love the sweet spot that htmx hits; please don't change that!

silver-arrow commented on Htmx is part of the GitHub Accelerator htmx.org/posts/2023-06-06... · Posted by u/jjdeveloper

afavour · 2 years ago

> It becomes very obvious that this is how web development should have evolved.

I have to disagree with that. I’m happy htmx exists and that it works for many but in my professional life I've found few cases where it's the best choice. And that’s fine! It’s a wonderful thing that the web has been able to grow in so many diverse ways, there should be no one way it “should have evolved”.

IMO this is the biggest mistake in web dev in the last decade or so: that there should be One Right Way. No matter if you’re making the next Gmail or if you’re making a static blog the cargo cult of an industry tells you it should all be done the same way when common sense would tell you that’s not the case at all.

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

That's fair. I agree - that type of blanket statement is not helpful in the technical realm. I should have kept it at just: HTML should have continued to be expanded into what htmx is doing.

silver-arrow commented on Htmx is part of the GitHub Accelerator htmx.org/posts/2023-06-06... · Posted by u/jjdeveloper

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

Great news.

I have had good success and a rewarding experience using htmx the past year. It has been so great in tandem with Clojure using hiccup for SSR.

Once htmx clicks for you, you are almost left stunned by how simple and flexible it is. You can't believe that this isn't how HTML evolved to as a hypermedia. It becomes very obvious that this is how web development should have evolved. I hope someday that what htmx is doing through javascript becomes baked right into HTML and the browser clients.

If you are mistakenly believing it is just some derivative of Angular or you are not grasping the significance of its advancement of the architecture of hypermedia, please do yourself a favor and read the excellent essays on their site; you will then truly understand what REST is and what the importance of real HATEOAS means: https://htmx.org/essays/

They also have a free book here: https://hypermedia.systems/

We made a costly wrong turn 10 -15 years ago by attempting to rebuild thick clients on the web with a JSON API architecture instead of expanding and enriching the new and powerful idea of the early web: hypermedia.

silver-arrow commented on Tips for Building SSR/HDA Applications htmx.org/essays/10-tips-f... · Posted by u/samwillis

recursivedoubts · 2 years ago

> 2003 called and it wants its network architecture back

yep:

https://htmx.org/essays/hateoas/

https://htmx.org/essays/a-real-world-react-to-htmx-port/

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

htmx is so wonderful. We have had amazing success utilizing it and returning to a hypermedia approach to web dev. The essays go into detail of why this is.

silver-arrow commented on htmx htmx.org/... · Posted by u/GavinAnderegg

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

I have immensely enjoyed and benefited from using htmx for the past 18 months on projects with Clojure as the backend language. I had done years of full-stack Angular then React on the front-end and Java Rest endpoints on the back-end with teams of all sizes.

htmx has been a revelation and has really opened my eyes to the nuances of hypermedia development modalities that I was ignorant of. For me, it has become very clear that htmx and hypermedia development is far more simple, productive, beneficial, and FUN for 90% of web dev use cases. I feel huge disappointment how unnecessarily web development evolved into bad client server rpc json protocol for basically everything web.

Kudos to the htxm creator and his vision of what should have been. My experience absolutely corroborates his thinking on these things.

silver-arrow commented on Htmx Is the Future quii.dev/HTMX_is_the_Futu... · Posted by u/quii

michaelchisari · 2 years ago

Everybody's arguing about whether Htmx can do this or that, or how it handles complex use case x, but Htmx can do 90% of what people need in an extremely simple and straight-forward way. That means it (or at least its approach) won't disappear.

A highly complex stock-trading application should absolutely not be using Htmx.

But a configuration page? A blog? Any basic app that doesn't require real-time updates? Htmx makes much more sense for those than React. And those simple needs are a much bigger part of the internet than the Hacker News crowd realizes or wants to admit.

If I could make one argument against SPA's it's not that they don't have their use, they obviously do, it's that we're using them for too much and too often. At some point we decided everything had to be an SPA and it was only a matter of time before people sobered up and realized things went too far.

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

Exactly! Well said

silver-arrow commented on Htmx Is the Future quii.dev/HTMX_is_the_Futu... · Posted by u/quii

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

htmx has provided the greatest satisfaction and production of my 30-year programming career. After a year of constant development experience with it, I am confident that this is the proper method of building web applications. It truly is how HTML should have evolved.

silver-arrow commented on Rich Hickey: Design in Practice youtube.com/watch?v=fTtnx... · Posted by u/simon_acca

silver-arrow · 2 years ago

That was such an educational experience! Great talk and speaker.