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kmod commented on In a first, Google has released data on how much energy an AI prompt uses   technologyreview.com/2025... · Posted by u/jeffbee
more_corn · 9 days ago
I’d love to believe this but maybe a citation would help.
kmod · 9 days ago
https://azallianceforgolf.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/C-S...

page 21, says Arizona 2015 golf course irrigation was 120 million gallons per day, citing the US Geological Survey.

https://dgtlinfra.com/data-center-water-usage/

says Google's datacenter water consumption in 2023 was 5.2 billion gallons, or ~14 million gallons a day. Microsoft was ~4.7, Facebook was 2.6, AWS didn't seem to disclose, Apple was 2.3. These numbers seem pulled from what the companies published.

The total for these companies was ~30 million gallons a day. Apply your best guesses as to what fraction of datacenter usage they are, what fraction of datacenter usage is AI, and what 2025 usage looks like compared to 2023. My guess is it's unlikely to come out to more than 120 million.

I didn't vet this that carefully so take the numbers with a grain of salt, but the rough comparison does seem to hold that Arizona golf courses are larger users of water.

Agricultural numbers are much higher, the California almond industry uses ~4000 million gallons of water a day.

kmod commented on In a first, Google has released data on how much energy an AI prompt uses   technologyreview.com/2025... · Posted by u/jeffbee
uncertainrhymes · 9 days ago
I was taken aback recently when a Gen-ish Z person told me AI was 'destroying all the water'. I've done data center work, and while I know it is used for cooling, I don't think I've ever personally destroyed any large bodies of water.

There is a perception out there about GenAI and water that goes surprisingly deep. I was told we are will be living in a drought-stricken hellscape, and AI is to blame.

I'd like to know the equivalent energy consumption of a single TikTok video, but that is probably arguing the wrong thing. My bigger question is ... where do they think that water goes? Steam? The assumption is that it is gone forever, and I can't get over how people could just take that at face value.

kmod · 9 days ago
I was also surprised when someone asked me about AI's water consumption because I had never heard of it being an issue. But a cursory search shows that datacenters use quite a bit more water than I realized, on the order of 1 liter of water per kWh of electricity. I see a lot of talk about how the hyperscalers are doing better than this and are trying to get to net-positive, but everything I saw was about quantifying and optimizing this number rather than debunking it as some sort of myth.

I find "1 liter per kWh" to be a bit hard to visualize, but when they talk about building a gigawatt datacenter, that's 278L/s. A typical showerhead is 0.16L/s. The Californian almond industry apparently uses roughly 200kL/s averaged over the entire year -- 278L/s is enough for about 4 square miles of almond orchards.

So it seems like a real thing but maybe not that drastic, especially since I think the hyperscaler numbers are better than this.

kmod commented on Gemini CLI   blog.google/technology/de... · Posted by u/sync
kmod · 2 months ago
I've found a method that gives me a lot more clarity about a company's privacy policy:

  1. Go to their enterprise site
  2. See what privacy guarantees they advertise above the consumer product
  3. Conclusion: those are things that you do not get in the consumer product
These companies do understand what privacy people want and how to write that in plain language, and they do that when they actually offer it (to their enterprise clients). You can diff this against what they say to their consumers to see where they are trying to find wiggle room ("finetuning" is not "training", "ever got free credits" means not-"is a paid account", etc)

For Code Assist, here's their enterprise-oriented page vs their consumer-oriented page:

https://cloud.google.com/gemini/docs/codeassist/security-pri...

https://developers.google.com/gemini-code-assist/resources/p...

It seems like these are both incomplete and one would need to read their overall pages, which would be something more like

https://support.google.com/a/answer/15706919?hl=en

https://support.google.com/gemini/answer/13594961?hl=en#revi...

kmod commented on Building supercomputers for autocrats probably isn't good for democracy   helentoner.substack.com/p... · Posted by u/rbanffy
tptacek · 3 months ago
I agree directionally with this but it drives me nuts how much special pleading there is about what high-profile companies like OpenAI do, vs. what low-profile industry giants like Cisco and Oracle have been doing for a whole generation. The analysis can't credibly start and end with what OpenAI is doing.
kmod · 3 months ago
I agree in general, but I think some important context here is that the author of this post was previously on the OpenAI board (the board that fired Sam Altman).
kmod commented on Google Gemini has the worst LLM API   venki.dev/notes/google-ge... · Posted by u/indigodaddy
kmod · 4 months ago
The worst part to me is the privacy nightmare with AI Studio. It's essentially impossible to tell whether any particular API call will end up being included in their training data since this depends on properties that are stored elsewhere and are not available to the developer -- even a simple property such as "does this account have billing enabled" is oddly difficult to evaluate, and I was told by their support that because I at one point had any free credits on my account that it was a trial account and not a billed account even though I had a credit card attached and was being charged. I don't know if this is true and there is no way for me to find out.

At some point they updated their privacy policy in regards to this, but instead of saying that this will cause them to train on your data, now the privacy policy says both that they will train on this data and that they will not train on this data, with no indication of which statement takes precedence over the other.

kmod commented on Google Gemini has the worst LLM API   venki.dev/notes/google-ge... · Posted by u/indigodaddy
sunaookami · 4 months ago
Not if you have billing enabled: https://ai.google.dev/gemini-api/docs/pricing
kmod · 4 months ago
There are a few conditions that take precedence over having-billing-enabled and will cause AI Studio to train on your data. This is why I personally use Vertex

u/kmod

KarmaCake day3160July 24, 2009
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