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jackdaniels4me commented on Show HN: FizzBee – Formal Model based autonomous testing   fizzbee.io/testing/... · Posted by u/jayaprabhakar
jackdaniels4me · 5 months ago
This is neat. I've used FizzBee and TLA+ for model checking. Being able to test the implementation would be nice. How is this different from test case generation in TLA+?
jackdaniels4me commented on Formal specs as sets of behaviors   surfingcomplexity.blog/20... · Posted by u/gm678
pron · 8 months ago
> there have been a number of formal specification tools that have been developed in recent years which use programming-language-like notation, such as FizzBee, P, PlusCal, and Quint. I think these notations are more approachable for programmers than the more set-theoretic notation of TLA+.

This statement may make it seem like the design of those other languages is a later development than TLA+, while the opposite is the case. Programming-language-like specification languages have existed continuously since the 70s and 80s (VDM, Estelle, SMV, Spin/PROMELLA - they were about as known to practising programmers at the time as the newer ones are known today...), as well as model-checkable programming languages similar to P (Esterel). The new incarnations are very similar to those from more than four decades ago.

TLA+ was the newer development, designed as a reaction to the old programming-like approach, which, Leslie Lamport felt, wasn't simple and succinct enough, didn't allow for specification at arbitrary levels of detail, and didn't allow for easy manipulation and substitution (e.g. that `x = 2` might mean something different from `x + 3 = 5` is not just added complexity, but makes it hard to describe the relationship between specifications of the same system at different levels of detail).

Lamport decided to ditch the older style in favour of one based almost solely on simple mathematics (there were some earlier attempts, but they were still more programming-like than TLA+). He didn't expect that mathematics at the level taught in an introductory, first-semester university course would be so unapproachable to programmers.

jackdaniels4me · 8 months ago
Lamport didn't design TLA+ for model checking or for practicing developers to use. He did purely for publishing papers where the researchers express their proofs as math (his new TLA+) instead of free form text.
jackdaniels4me commented on Formal Methods: Just Good Engineering Practice? (2024)   brooker.co.za/blog/2024/0... · Posted by u/aiono
pnathan · a year ago
What's your recommendation on how to rapidly learn TLA+? I spent some time staring at references and the UI a few months ago and came away very defeated. But I'd like to actually level up here.
jackdaniels4me commented on Show HN: Generate System Design diagrams from design spec   fizzbee.io/tutorials/visu... · Posted by u/jayaprabhakar
jackdaniels4me · 2 years ago
This is neat! How does this compare with tools like draw.io or mermaidjs

u/jackdaniels4me

KarmaCake day1September 4, 2024View Original