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Paul-Craft commented on So you want to parse a PDF?   eliot-jones.com/2025/8/pd... · Posted by u/UglyToad
wackget · a month ago
> So you want to parse a PDF?

Absolutely not. For the reasons in the article.

Paul-Craft · 25 days ago
No shit. I've made that mistake before, not gonna try it again.
Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
ongy · a month ago
You are making two assumptions that are generally not true

* In the US * Interviewee is currently unemployed

Even then, the general candidate we interview for Tech positions can usually survive quite well on a couple months.

Paul-Craft · a month ago
I'm speaking to what I know. Sue me.
Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
ndriscoll · a month ago
Like I said, this is literally a thing I do all the time. I have standing 1 hour blocks for each of my team members every week and it's not uncommon for us to build out the skeleton of a problem solution together. I literally did what you said on Wednesday for someone for a gitlab change because I don't expect they know how secret injection works, but I want them to know. And absolutely I've encouraged them to ask questions, and I ask them questions to check their understanding.
Paul-Craft · a month ago
Like I said, that's not the same. It's not comparable in terms of stakes, or expected outputs. You're not addressing the issue.
Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
nabla9 · a month ago
Being below average is not disability.

You want to hire someone good. You try to find many ways to weed all others out so that what is left is good.

Paul-Craft · a month ago
Mental health conditions can be disabilities. Again: are you saying you discriminate against people with disabilities?
Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
smugglerFlynn · a month ago
> we have to replace them with something that works

We don't. The simple solution is to stop maintaining the illusion that 100% perfect hire is possible.

Design your post-hire process around imperfect hiring rate / quick feedback loop, and accept the losses (they will happen anyway despite any perfectionistic illusions you choose to maintain).

These are few questions that really matter:

   - Is there a track record of delivering meaningful results?
   - Does their past experience seem credible?
   - Are their soft skills and communication skills up to your expectations?
   - Do they demonstrate adequate hard skills for the role?
   - What interests and motivates them on professional and personal level?
Your interview process will always be just an attempt at answering these somewhat accurately, with diminishing returns after a certain point. Getting actual accurate answer to these is only possible through collaborative work in real environment.

Paul-Craft · a month ago
I'm gonna stop you right here, because I never said any such thing:

> We don't. The simple solution is to stop maintaining the illusion that 100% perfect hire is possible.

Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
ndriscoll · a month ago
It's not artificial: the company has a day of my time. I have a day of their time. We both want me to meet several people on the team to see if it's a good fit. Because of the constraint, we keep it to relatively simple discussions around toy problems that can be solved in an hour.
Paul-Craft · a month ago
Yes, it is artificial. Everything about a live coding interview is artificial. Code doesn't get written in 1 hour blocks while someone's watching over one's shoulder, all the while asking questions to interrupt one's thought process, in any company I've ever worked for.
Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
nabla9 · a month ago
A good employer takes care of their worker even if they have problems, but they also want to weed out as much of them before hiring.

Mentally strong and healthy people who do well when challenged are good hires.

Paul-Craft · a month ago
> Mentally strong and healthy people who do well when challenged are good hires.

So, you discriminate against disabled people?

Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
gwbas1c · a month ago
I've started to treat live coding screening sessions as a "conversation about code." I make sure that the candidate knows that I'm trying to make sure we can discuss code.

Why?

Purely being a "good programmer" isn't just enough for the job. It's important that we can develop a good working rapport, and communicate.

For example: Someone who's an expert programmer might misinterpret a discussion and build the wrong thing; or someone might be a great programmer but otherwise be impossible to actually conduct a technical discussion.

IE, this is why "Fizzbuz"-style questions work so well: It's not really screening that you're a great programmer, it's screening your ability to have a technical discussion.

Paul-Craft · a month ago
I think that's a good approach. I can write FizzBuzz in 4 different programming styles, in at least 3 different programming languages, and I'd be happy to talk about all 12 permutations of them.
Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
ndriscoll · a month ago
I sit down with juniors and sketch out designs or code for them while talking through the thought process at least once a week, and even when solo coding, I expect everyone produces work that explains itself. For particularly complex/nuanced changes, people do hop on a call to talk through it.

Like I said the deadlines work for both sides. If a company wants to give homework instead of having their own senior engineers spend time talking to me, that tells me what I need to know about how they value my time.

Paul-Craft · a month ago
> I sit down with juniors and sketch out designs or code for them while talking through the thought process at least once a week, and even when solo coding, I expect everyone produces work that explains itself. For particularly complex/nuanced changes, people do hop on a call to talk through it.

That's not equivalent to what I said, nor is it live coding.

Again, those deadlines are artificially short compared to real world scenarios, and completely arbitrary. They are so short, in fact, that they render the interview an invalid test of real working ability. A work sample has been proven time and again to be the most valid measure of whether a candidate can actually perform the job, but the conditions under which a live coded "work sample" is performed in an interview render it invalid.

Paul-Craft commented on Live coding interviews measure stress, not coding skills   hadid.dev/posts/living-co... · Posted by u/mustaphah
ndriscoll · a month ago
The short deadlines are because neither the company nor the candidate wants to spend a month on an extended interview. Solving a problem and walking through the thought process are because that's what "coding" is.
Paul-Craft · a month ago
I don't know about you, but I've never had to live code a PR and explain to my reviewer what I was thinking while writing the code. By "deadlines" I'm referring to the length of the interview. Take home problems theoretically solve both these issues, but they need to be properly scoped and specified to be valid assessments.

u/Paul-Craft

KarmaCake day3037April 11, 2023View Original