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Posted by u/Akula112233 a year ago
Launch HN: Sift Dev (YC W25) – AI-Powered Datadog Alternative
Hi HN! We're Kaushik and Ishir. We’re building SiftDev (https://app.trysift.dev/docs), an intelligent logging tool that understands your observability data in real time, automatically identifies anomalies, and lets you interact with your logs through natural language queries. Here’s a demo video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQ-TTdiu3fc&t=20s, and there's a demo playground you can try out here: https://app.trysift.dev/.

We used to work on product and engineering at Datadog and Splunk. We saw how even teams using these industry-leading tools were struggling to effectively interpret and use their logging data. The sheer volume of logs overwhelmed experts and newcomers alike, making it difficult to quickly identify meaningful issues or patterns. Despite powerful indexing and search capabilities, developers still had to manually piece together context from different logs, dashboards, and sources—a tedious and error-prone process.

The “noisy logging” problem—that is, the gap between overwhelming amounts of raw log data and insights people can act on—ultimately is a gap between machines (which generate all this data) and humans (who want and need the insights). SiftDev is built to bridge that gap and to automate the tedious, manual aspects of debugging and observability. In marketing-speak: “humans should never have to look at a log again!” We think people should interact with their data in terms that make sense on a human level.

What makes SiftDev different is its understanding of application context over time. While traditional tooling typically lets developers analyze logs in isolation, or with minimal surrounding context, SiftDev builds comprehensive profiles of your application's normal behavior patterns. This awareness allows us to understand what's truly abnormal versus what might appear unusual in a single snapshot but is actually expected behavior for your specific application. SiftDev applies semantic analysis and profiling to understand your application's logging behavior holistically. Instead of relying solely on manual search, Sift identifies core application processes, automatically detects patterns, and surfaces anomalies, including clear explanations and context.

Here are some examples of what this can look like in practice: Identify core processes: SiftDev instantly recognizes your payment workflows—like authorization, capture, and refunds—without manual tagging. Detect performance patterns: SiftDev learns your nightly batch job typically handles 10,000 records in 45 minutes, establishing a clear baseline. Surface hidden anomalies: SiftDev flags silent failures, such as two microservices updating the same record within 50ms—issues normally hidden by routine logs.

You can then directly ask your logs questions like, “What's causing errors in our checkout service?” or “Why did latency spike at 2 AM?” and immediately receive insightful, actionable answers that you’d otherwise manually be searching for.

We’d love for you to test out our product via our demo playground at https://app.trysift.dev/! It’s a slightly less functional version of our platform but shares a lot of the core features. Note: we do need users to sign up to do this but waitlist is optional (of course).

We'd love your feedback, thoughts, and experiences dealing with logging and observability challenges!

nextts · a year ago
Funny I was thinking this week logging needs some magic.

Log diving takes a lot of time especially during some kind of outage/downtime/bug where the whole team might be watching a screen share of someone diving into logs.

At the same time I am sceptical about "AI" especially if it is just an LLM stumbling around.

Understanding logs is probably the most brain intensive part of the job for me, more so than system design, project planning or coding.

This is because you need to know where the code is logging, imagine code paths in your head and you constantly see stuff that is a red herring or doesn't make sense.

I hope you can improve this space but it won't be easy!

Akula112233 · a year ago
Very relatable experience with log diving, feels very much like a needle-in-haystack problem that gets so much harder when you're not the only one who contributed to the source of errors (often the case).

As for the skepticism with LLMs stumbling around raw logs: it's super deserved. Even the developers who wrote the program often refer to larger app context when debugging, so it's not as easy as throwing a bunch of logs into an LLM. Plus, context window limits & the relative lack of "understanding" with increasingly larger contexts is troublesome.

We found it helped a lot to profile application logs over time. Think aggregation, but for individual flows rather than similar logs. By grouping and ordering flows together, it's bringing the context of thousands of (repetitive) logs down to the core flows. Much easier to find when things are out of the ordinary.

Still a lot of improvements in regards to false positives and variations in application flows.

ohgr · a year ago
The best way to improve this is to just generate decent useful and actionable logs. Sifting through a trash heap is where the problem is. No magic will suddenly turn that trash into gold.

You have to do this at the inception of the software you’re building rather then strap it on the donkey when something breaks (the usual way).

Akula112233 · a year ago
Yep, but it's sometimes a compromise people may be unwilling to make. Too often I hear (and have seen via DD customers) horror stories about initiatives to fix observability squashed by teams in hopes of shipping.

Moving fast has it's downsides and I can't say I blame people for deprioritizing good logging practices. But it does come back to bite...

Though as a caveat, you don't always have control over your logs -- especially with third party services, large but fragmented engineering organizations, etc. -- even with great internal practices, there's always something.

On another note, access to codebase + live logs gives room to develop better auto-instrumentation tooling. Though perhaps cursor could do a decent enough job at starting folks off

bmurphy1976 · a year ago
This is part of hardening a system for production. Making it easy to operate:

* Make sure the logs are actionable

* Make sure the logs are readable

* Make sure you are collecting operational metrics

* Make sure the metrics are useful

* Make sure you have error handling

* Make sure you have alerting

* Make sure you document how to support the application

* Make sure you have knows and levers you can pull in an emergency to change the systems behavior or fix things

* Make sure you have vetted the system for security issues

etc.

cthuen · a year ago
Disclaimer: I'm a founder at Gravwell, a log analytics startup

I agree, even when applicable LLMs are relegated to analyzing subselected data, so logs have to go somewhere else first. I think understanding logs is brain intensive because it can be a tricky problem. It gets easier with good tools, but often those tools are the kind that need to be used to build something else that solves the problem, rather than solve the problem themselves (e.g. building a good query + automation). I think LLMs can get better at creating the queries which would help a lot.

We started Gravwell to try bring some magic. It's a schema-on-read time-series data lake that will eat text or binary and comes in SaaS or self-hosted (on-prem). We built our backend from scratch to offer maximum flexibility in query. The search syntax looks like a linux command line, and kinda behaves like one too. Chain modules together to extract, filter, aggregate, enrich, etc. Automation system included. If you like Splunk, you should check us out.

There's a free community edition (personal or commercial use) for 2GB/day anon or 14GB/day w/ email. Tech docs are open at docs.gravwell.io.

evil-olive · a year ago
> SiftDev flags silent failures, such as two microservices updating the same record within 50ms

I don't understand, what about that is a "silent failure"?

in order for your product to even know about it, wouldn't I need to write a log message for every single record update?

and if my architecture allows two microservices to update the same row in the same database...maybe it happening within 50ms is expected?

that could be an inefficient architecture for sure, but I'm confused as to whether your product is also trying to give me recommendations about "here's an architectural inefficiency we found based on feeding your logs to an LLM"

> You can then directly ask your logs questions like, “What's causing errors in our checkout service?” or “Why did latency spike at 2 AM?” and immediately receive insightful, actionable answers that you’d otherwise manually be searching for.

the general question I have with any product that's marketing itself as being "AI-powered" - how do hallucinations get resolved?

I already have human coworkers who will investigate some error or alert or performance problem, and come to an incorrect conclusion about the cause.

when that happens I can walk through their thought process and analysis chain with them and identify the gap that led them to the incorrect conclusion. often this is a useful signal that our system documentation needs to be updated, or log messages need to be clarified, or a dashboard should include a different metric, etc etc.

if I ask your product "what caused such-and-such outage" and the answer that comes back is incorrect, how do I "teach" it the correct answer?

Akula112233 · a year ago
> I don't understand, what about that is a "silent failure"?

Silent failures can be "allowed" behavior in your applications that aren't actually labeled as errors but can be irregular. Think race conditions, deadlocks, silent timeouts, or even just mislabeled error logs.

> in order for your product to even know about it, wouldn't I need to write a log message for every single record update?

That's right, and this may not always feasible (or necessary!), but if your application can be impacted by errors like these, perhaps it may be worth logging anyway.

> the general question I have with any product that's marketing itself as being "AI-powered" - how do hallucinations get resolved?

> and if my architecture allows two microservices to update the same row in the same database...maybe it happening within 50ms is expected?

> if I ask your product "what caused such-and-such outage" and the answer that comes back is incorrect, how do I "teach" it the correct answer?

For these concerns, human-in-loop feedback is our preliminary approach! We have our own internally running to account for changes and false errors, but having explanations from human input (even as simple as "Not an error" or "Missed error" buttons) is very helpful.

> when that happens I can walk through their thought process and analysis chain with them and identify the gap that led them to the incorrect conclusion. often this is a useful signal that our system documentation needs to be updated, or log messages need to be clarified, or a dashboard should include a different metric, etc etc.

Got it, I imagine it'll be very helpful for us to display our chain of thought from our dashboards too. Great feedback, thank you!

evil-olive · a year ago
> Think race conditions, deadlocks, silent timeouts, or even just mislabeled error logs.

I agree that those are bad things.

but how does your product help me with them?

I have some code that has a deadlock. are you suggesting that I can find the deadlock by shipping my logs to a 3rd-party service that will feed them into an LLM?

999900000999 · a year ago
Can it run completely on prem ?

In most of the industries I work in we would never just send you our logs.

What stops me from building my own logger that sends a request to write a record to a DB and later asks an LLM what it means ?

Where is the pricing information?

Why do I need to login visit your homepage? How would I pitch this to my boss if they can’t read what it does ?

Edit: https://runsift.com/pricing.html

I see the landing page. The pricing should be clear though “ Contact Us” is scary.

Akula112233 · a year ago
> Can it run completely on prem ?

Yep we have an on-prem offering as well, got similar notes from folks before!

> What stops me from building my own logger that sends a request to write a record to a DB and later asks an LLM what it means ?

Great question! The main limitation over brute force is the sheer volume of noise, and therefore relevant context. We tried this and realized it wasn't working. From a numbers perspective, at even just 10s of GBs/day scale of data (not even close to enterprise scale), mainstream LLMs can't provide the context windows you need for more than a few minutes of operational data. And larger models suffer from other factors (like attention diffusion / dilution & drift).

> I see the landing page. The pricing should be clear though “ Contact Us” is scary. Noted!

999900000999 · a year ago
Thanks!

I hope my tone wasn’t too brash.

If you can update the pricing I might be able to pitch this to my org later this year. We’d definitely like an on prem solution though!

vardaro · a year ago
Neat idea. Why logs, and not metrics too? You can characterize an accurate "baseline" system behavior through a combination of system level and userspace metrics. This profile would offer more depth than what you'd otherwise piece together with userspace logs.
Akula112233 · a year ago
Agreed! Metrics are a high priority, especially since working to increase the available context around each anomaly we flag.

Logs were a natural starting point because that’s where developers often spend a significant amount of time stuck reading & searching for the right information, manually tracking down issues + jumping between logs across services. In a way, just finding & summarizing relevant logs for the user gave people an easier time debugging.

But metrics will introduce more dimensions to establish baseline behavior, so we're pretty excited about it too.

vardaro · a year ago
I tend to use logs the least when debugging production issues. I realize that's a personal anecdote, so I see your point.
csomar · a year ago
Can you explain what goes through an LLM and what does not. You offer 100K logs per day for free but if all of these goes through an LLM, this will burn "thousands?" of dollars every month for a free customer that is milking the machine.
Akula112233 · a year ago
Our free tier doesn't include the anomaly/error detection (noted on the site, we can make it more clear though). And your numbers do add up! That's why you can't just run all your logs through an LLM.

Aggregated (+ simplified) versions of your logs + flagged anomalies get passed through our LLMs

mdaniel · a year ago
Your python sdk's <https://pypi.org/project/sift-dev-logger> GH link is 404: <https://github.com/sift-dev/python-sdk> Navigating upward shows the fork of SigNoz which I think is funny

There was no GH link for your npm dep so maybe they're both private. Although npmjs shows your npm one as ISC licensed, likely because of the default in package.json

Akula112233 · a year ago
Ah, any particular reason to want these SDKs public? Happy to, especially since you can see source on install anyway. Just curious!

And Kudos to SigNoz as well - have to check out other folks in the space :)

mdaniel · a year ago
My initial concern was what transitive deps it was pulling in, but the other answer to your question is the thing that most GH repos are good for: submitting bugs and submitting fixes

It is also good for finding out what the buffering story is, because I would want to know if I'm dragging in an unbounded queue into my app (putting memory pressure on me) or knowing that your service returning 503s is going to eat logs. The kind of thing that only looking at the source would say for sure because the docs don't even hint at such operational concerns

Anyway, the only reason I mentioned the dead link is because your PyPI page linked to GH in the first place. So if you don't intend people to think there's supposed to be a repo, then I'd suggest removing the repo link

theogravity · a year ago
Hi, I'm the author of LogLayer (https://loglayer.dev) for Typescript, which has integration with DataDog and competitors. Sift looks easy to integrate with since you have a TS library and the API is straightforward.

Would you like me to create a transport for it (I'm not implying I'd be charging to do this; it'd be free)?

The benefit of LogLayer is that they'd just use the loglayer library to make their log calls and it ships it to whatever transports they have defined for it. Better than having them manage two separate loggers (eg Sift and Pino for example) or write their own wrapper.

Ishirv · a year ago
Hey, loglayer looks super cool! Would love to chat and set something up, send us an email at founders@runsift.com
theogravity · a year ago
Sent an e-mail!
kbouck · a year ago
From the docs it looks like you ingest directly from apps instrumented with your libraries. Do you also plan to ingest OpenTelemetry events, such as those exported from an OpenTelemetry agent, or OpenTelemetry collector?
Akula112233 · a year ago
Yes, we support OpenTelemetry ingestion! Also Datadog, Splunk, and various other vendors’ agents/forwarders - even custom HTTP Daemons.

If you’ve already set up logging, good chance you can just point your instrumentation towards us and we know how to ingest and handle it.