>> "And then not only are EVs more expensive, but their own salespeople are untrained. They don't even know how to answer most of the questions they get. A lot of them have 100–200 percent turnover of their sales staff in a given year," Reigersman told me.
IOW, the dealerships only want to sell what is easy. They do not want to invest in their people to learn how to sell the cars. They all grumble a bit when the manufacturers require $$Millions in capital investment to sell & service their cars, but are now balking at expense of training their people.
It is far past time to kill requirements that cars cannot be sold direct. If the dealership cannot or will not sell the EVs, then the companies should be able to route around dealers.
I'd bet we'll suddenly find that their salespeople are all trained up and selling EVs like hotcakes after that.
>>Do people actually believe anything a car salesman says anyway?
Used car? Very little
New car? I've found a few good ones, and much of what they need to say is verifiable (e.g., in the specs in a brochure / official website).
I think the point was that customers can't even get basic info out of these people, and they aren't even offering their usual level of encouragement to buy. I.e., the car sales people (and the managers failing to provide training) are not doing their jobs. If they don't want to do their jobs, then the companies should be able to route around them.
Dealerships (maintenance and new sales), Oil/Exhaust/Brake, and Gas stations will decimated -- as car owners no longer have a system that neglect (oil, coolant, high temp exhaust, high temp seals and sensors) causes an end of life event.
At most, battery packs will be neglected when cars sit, but vehicles today with a the sensors and systems that run lithium ion batteries safely will reduce many of the impacts of neglect.
But mostly new sales, even used market sales; the interior will be the primary part of a vehicle that ages (ignoring the effect of salt on roads)
EVs still use oil and coolant though just that the oil never needs changing. And EVs still have issues needing you to go to the service. My mate had to take his ID.3 to the service 3 times due to SW issues. EVs aren't immune from issues.
They might be telling that to the administration, but the problem is apparently not so severe as to get them to drop their prices. I'll believe them when I see deep dealer discounts on EVs.
Problem, currently I can’t get solar (townhome, old roof, HOA). And without solar, with PG&E prices which keep going up, I’m not really sure EVs make a lot of sense given their cost and the fact I’ll have to spend $5-$10K (not exactly sure) to install the 240V charger.
One of our cars is a plug in hybrid, so with 110V overnight charging for many trips and gas range for longer trips we get the best of both.
Our next car might also be a plug-in or a hybrid. EV, I just don’t see a good option ( sorry, FWIW, not going to consider a Tesla due to Musk)
Yes, I feel, may not be correct, that plug-in hybrids are a little underrated. Most have very short ranges, I wish the range could be longer. Rav-4 has the best range that I know of, but they are hard to find and with the newer tax credits hard to justify, as they are not built in the US they don’t qualify for tax credits.
OTOH, I hate oil changes, so that is my personal reason to go full EV since technically they require less routine maintenance as they are simpler.
It's true, car dealers "can't sell" EVs. Not because people don't want EVs, but because dealers either don't want to sell them, or don't know how to sell them.
I've owned 3 EVs since 2016 and I've been to franchise dealerships each time. I've been to dealerships both with and without dedicated or specially trained EV sales reps.
Sales reps who've not had any specific training on selling EVs, working in dealerships with no dedicated EV showroom space are _terrible_ at selling EVs IME. At best they're disinterested in making a sale, at worst they actively discourage you with all the common EV related FUD.
Showrooms with dedicated space to showcase EV product offerings, information about EVs and which have marketing material actively incentivising the benefits of an EV, also have sales reps who are knowledgeable, helpful, and actively seeking to close a sale.
If you think inserting a plug into a socket is "cumbersome" perhaps. Plus you can do it at home, while you sleep. If you're on a long trip the range is long enough now that is a good reason to stretch your legs and hydrate.
That not every customer wants an EV or that an EV is not the best car for every customer is no excuse for sales reps being subpar when it comes to EVs. Especially when the car industry does not take sales rep performance into account when evaluating EV sales at dealerships.
I don't want an EV. Well, I'm not opposed to an EV, but I am opposed to a car that phones to someone's server somewhere. That excludes (AFAICT) all EVs and non-EV cars of recent vintage.
Personally I think the availability of rental EVs has done a lot to dampen excitement about _owning_ an EV. It certainly did for me. Driving one is a lot of fun but using it outside about 100 miles of where you park it each night is fraught.
Insurance rates are much higher because of the extremely high repair costs for even minor collisions. Consequently EVs are 'totaled' much more easily than equivalent hybrid or gas vehicles. Eastern Europe is doing a booming business in refurbished EVs shipped over from the US.
Then there are the issues of battery production and disposal which can do a lot to mitigate the environmental benefits of an EV.
These details, aside from charging, weren't readily apparent at first. But they are real and they are expensive.
> Today, the supply of unsold BEVs is surging, as they are not selling nearly as fast as they are arriving at our dealerships—even with deep price cuts, manufacturer incentives, and generous government incentives.
have they tried improving the quality of the cars?
Readit News
>> "And then not only are EVs more expensive, but their own salespeople are untrained. They don't even know how to answer most of the questions they get. A lot of them have 100–200 percent turnover of their sales staff in a given year," Reigersman told me.
IOW, the dealerships only want to sell what is easy. They do not want to invest in their people to learn how to sell the cars. They all grumble a bit when the manufacturers require $$Millions in capital investment to sell & service their cars, but are now balking at expense of training their people.
It is far past time to kill requirements that cars cannot be sold direct. If the dealership cannot or will not sell the EVs, then the companies should be able to route around dealers.
I'd bet we'll suddenly find that their salespeople are all trained up and selling EVs like hotcakes after that.
Do people actually believe anything a car salesman says anyway?
Used car? Very little
New car? I've found a few good ones, and much of what they need to say is verifiable (e.g., in the specs in a brochure / official website).
I think the point was that customers can't even get basic info out of these people, and they aren't even offering their usual level of encouragement to buy. I.e., the car sales people (and the managers failing to provide training) are not doing their jobs. If they don't want to do their jobs, then the companies should be able to route around them.
Dealerships (maintenance and new sales), Oil/Exhaust/Brake, and Gas stations will decimated -- as car owners no longer have a system that neglect (oil, coolant, high temp exhaust, high temp seals and sensors) causes an end of life event.
At most, battery packs will be neglected when cars sit, but vehicles today with a the sensors and systems that run lithium ion batteries safely will reduce many of the impacts of neglect.
But mostly new sales, even used market sales; the interior will be the primary part of a vehicle that ages (ignoring the effect of salt on roads)
Base MSRP: S1 $49,995
+ Destination: S17 $1,995
= Total MSRP: S16 $51,990
= Est. Net Price: S5 $51,990
Problem, currently I can’t get solar (townhome, old roof, HOA). And without solar, with PG&E prices which keep going up, I’m not really sure EVs make a lot of sense given their cost and the fact I’ll have to spend $5-$10K (not exactly sure) to install the 240V charger.
One of our cars is a plug in hybrid, so with 110V overnight charging for many trips and gas range for longer trips we get the best of both.
Our next car might also be a plug-in or a hybrid. EV, I just don’t see a good option ( sorry, FWIW, not going to consider a Tesla due to Musk)
OTOH, I hate oil changes, so that is my personal reason to go full EV since technically they require less routine maintenance as they are simpler.
But you do make an interesting point, that marginal might be lower which may change the math. Hadn’t considered that.
I've owned 3 EVs since 2016 and I've been to franchise dealerships each time. I've been to dealerships both with and without dedicated or specially trained EV sales reps.
Sales reps who've not had any specific training on selling EVs, working in dealerships with no dedicated EV showroom space are _terrible_ at selling EVs IME. At best they're disinterested in making a sale, at worst they actively discourage you with all the common EV related FUD.
Showrooms with dedicated space to showcase EV product offerings, information about EVs and which have marketing material actively incentivising the benefits of an EV, also have sales reps who are knowledgeable, helpful, and actively seeking to close a sale.
EV’s will never be a viable option until they are better in every facet than a combustion engine.
The charging is cumbersome and much longer than filling a gas tank, hard pass.
I would buy a combustion engine car, even if it was more expensive, for this reason alone.
During my ownership I did 3 longer trips. Total charge time is about 1.5 hours.
There's a reason car sales in NYC are still sub-1% EVs.
Insurance rates are much higher because of the extremely high repair costs for even minor collisions. Consequently EVs are 'totaled' much more easily than equivalent hybrid or gas vehicles. Eastern Europe is doing a booming business in refurbished EVs shipped over from the US.
Then there are the issues of battery production and disposal which can do a lot to mitigate the environmental benefits of an EV.
These details, aside from charging, weren't readily apparent at first. But they are real and they are expensive.
have they tried improving the quality of the cars?