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johnfactorial commented on Brazil fines Facebook $1.6M for improper sharing of user data   reuters.com/article/us-fa... · Posted by u/hhs
juusto · 6 years ago
At least it is something right? Also a deterrent to future actions by same/other companies.

Out of curiosity, how much do you think would an appropriate fine be?

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
I've often heard suggestions that fines be specified in law as percentages of revenue. IANAL and don't know how feasible that is, but it makes more sense to me than raw dollar amounts which, by their nature, make crime more affordable over time due to inflation and more affordable in proportion to income.

I.e. a $5 fine is a harsher punishment in 1990 than in 2020, and is a greater deterrent to someone with $50 in their pocket than someone with $50,000. But a fine of 1% of yearly revenue is the same effect across time and class.

johnfactorial commented on Show HN: MassCode – a code snippets manager for developers   github.com/antonreshetov/... · Posted by u/antonreshetov
wnoise · 6 years ago
Stet.

The comment wasn't particularly unfriendly at all. It didn't contain any personal attacks or contentless bashing. Indeed, the comment did something valuable: identified a problem, and thoroughly described why it was a problem. If the only way some one can give usable problem analysis and criticism is by including suggested fixes, and delicately toning down the criticism, then far fewer people are going to be willing to expend enough effort to interact beyond meaningless cheerleaderism.

In fact, your suggestion of a different way to criticize comes across to me as incredibly condescending -- to both the commenter and the original author.

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
I agree that the original comment was not overtly _un_friendly. I also think that the reply represents a better way.

> If the only way some one can give usable problem analysis and criticism is by including suggested fixes,

I think we can all agree that the inclusion of suggested fixes does make feedback more helpful in general.

> and delicately toning down the criticism, then far fewer people are going to be willing to expend enough effort to interact

It does require a little additional effort to write kinder feedback, to take the moment to address the human being behind an Internet comment in a similar way to how we might address a person face to face. I'm as guilty as any of failing in that way.

But if criticism's aim is to improve, it will be more successful if it's more easily digested by its audience. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar and all that.

And really the reply above isn't that big a difference. In my view, it's a sign of intelligence, learning how to communicate effectively. If raising the bar only this high results in "far fewer people" interacting, maybe that's a good thing. I don't really need to hear from people unable to tame their own words when they have no time limit on typing them, and I'd rather belong to a community with fewer responses but a higher proportion of politeness and shared humanity than an array of comments expressing the kind of gruff emphasis on failure that bookends the original comment, "Your gif doesn't convey your idea __at all__," and "i'm confused as to why this project even exists."

Edit: BTW today I learned "stet" thanks to you.

johnfactorial commented on E-scooter company goes bust after spending big on Facebook ads   bbc.com/news/technology-5... · Posted by u/Nemant
jberm123 · 6 years ago
>what's to stop the same employees and founders from following that method ad infinitum?

Informed consumers

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
Informing all consumers in the market is not a legitimately accomplishable solution to the problem. As long as there are 350 consumers unaware that these people have done this before, and they never have a day in court over it, this story can repeat itself forever.

Maybe informed lenders is a solution, though.

johnfactorial commented on E-scooter company goes bust after spending big on Facebook ads   bbc.com/news/technology-5... · Posted by u/Nemant
jberm123 · 6 years ago
I don't think you are either. But it's a risk you're taking buying a product from a fledgling internet-based startup. Shall we make it easier to start an internet-based business over a brick and mortar shop with laws that benefit the former with the latter's inherent advantage?
johnfactorial · 6 years ago
> But it's a risk you're taking buying a product from a fledgling internet-based startup.

This is my problem. It is not reasonable to expect a purchase of a product online to be a gamble, a risk that you will get nothing in exchange for your money. No matter whether they're internet based, no matter how old they are, if a company offers a product for sale, it should not be "risky" to purchase it.

The comment I replied to said we shouldn't burden the courts with taking the people behind such companies to task. But if we don't, there's nothing stopping them from doing it again and again.

johnfactorial commented on E-scooter company goes bust after spending big on Facebook ads   bbc.com/news/technology-5... · Posted by u/Nemant
flyGuyOnTheSly · 6 years ago
You're not wrong, you're an idealist, which typically are very closely intertwined when it comes to reality.

If you gave $700 to a company who promised to deliver you a scooter a few years down the line if all of the dominoes fell exactly as planned... I would argue that you got what you paid for even if it amounts to nothing tangible in the long run.

Which is to say, you paid for a pricey digital lottery ticket with a very low potential ROI.

It's a crying shame, absolutely.

But it's nothing to burden the court systems with.

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
> If you gave $700 to a company who promised to deliver you a scooter a few years down the line if all of the dominoes fell exactly as planned... I would argue that you got what you paid for even if it amounts to nothing tangible in the long run.

Is that what happened with this company? That's the model of kickstarters and the like, but this story sounds like it was a real company offering a product for sale. If a company can form, offer a product, sell 350 units, pay employees & expenses, then fold without delivering product or refund, nor facing any legal repercussions, what's to stop the same employees and founders from following that method ad infinitum? Form company #2, offer a different vapor, take in money from sales of the never-to-be product, spend it on salaries, declare that the product won't be delivered nor refunds given, and move on to company #3. If that's what this company has done, and the court systems are never burdened with tackling such an issue, it is a viable if entirely unethical model for the people involved.

johnfactorial commented on “My Google account got suspended because of NewPipe”   github.com/TeamNewPipe/Ne... · Posted by u/nuxdie
tyri_kai_psomi · 6 years ago
I see this meme a lot on the internet, especially when the US political justice system comes up lately, and it shows just how little our generation and younger care about how government works, is intended to work, and what to do when it doesn't work, the latter point being the most important. Going to social media and complaining, for example, is a good example of what not to do.

The control is only authoritarian if those being controlled by it have no recourse. As applied to governments, authoritarianism has strong central power and limited political freedoms. In the US, we believe in the principles of limited central power, and many political freedoms. (Whether or not this is the situation depending on who you are is the topic of another day because this is how it should be, and the only way it may have become not that is if we have allowed our complacencies to kick in and allow it to happen. I am a firm believer in the concept of "people get the government they deserve in a democracy." ) Ultimately the governmental authoritarian control is beholden to the people and can be eradicated. The only reason we feel as if it can't be is because we have allowed the power to creep up over the years and it seems like an insurmountable mountain, but rest assured if you pick up that pick axe and start chipping away rock by rock you absolutely can tear it down.

Likewise, authoritarianism applied to a corporation implies strong central power, and limited consumer freedoms. This is also patently false in the US. The US has anti-trust laws to prevent centralized control, consumer protection agencies, and the free market. The consumer ultimately always has the freedom to choose another option. If the corporation loses too many consumers, then the corporation goes under. I understand there is a lot of nuance, but this is the basic principles of how things should operate in this country, and the mechanisms for things to operate are in fact there. The question then becomes what are it's people doing about it?

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
> the only way it may have become not that is if we have allowed our complacencies to kick in

Just wanted to observe that this belief presupposes the US ever lived up to the principles you outline. US history shows that the country has never quite lived up to its touted values.

johnfactorial commented on Exposure to air pollution is linked to an increase in violent crime   economist.com/graphic-det... · Posted by u/pseudolus
BurningFrog · 6 years ago
Well, I think it's a fact¹ that a large majority of "science" stories that go viral turn out to be wrong.

So the rational approach to them is "what might be wrong with this one?".

¹ Citation Missing

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
The rational approach to all peer review is to assume there's a flaw and look for it. Quite a few commenters seem bothered by this reflexive reaction to published research, when the entire point of publishing research is to have it picked apart by critical thinkers everywhere.
johnfactorial commented on Exposure to air pollution is linked to an increase in violent crime   economist.com/graphic-det... · Posted by u/pseudolus
ceejayoz · 6 years ago
"Suggest and could" are different than "indicate and will".
johnfactorial · 6 years ago
This is probably the nuance I'm missing.
johnfactorial commented on Exposure to air pollution is linked to an increase in violent crime   economist.com/graphic-det... · Posted by u/pseudolus
hatmatrix · 6 years ago
If you read the article:

> Correlation is not causation of course (there may, for example, be a third variable affecting both pollution and crime) and the authors are cautious not to speculate about the precise mechanism by which contaminated air might lead to more rapes or robberies.

johnfactorial · 6 years ago
From the paper's abstract, though, "The results suggest that a 10% reduction in daily PM2.5 and ozone could save $1.4 billion in crime costs per year, a previously overlooked cost associated with pollution." This statement sounds like it's implying a causal relationship to me.

u/johnfactorial

KarmaCake day376April 14, 2014View Original