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edwardbernays commented on We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness   newyorker.com/magazine/20... · Posted by u/defo10
scotty79 · 7 months ago
I think desire for "real" is just a form of masochism. This real that people talk about is just suffering in sufficient amount to silence their restless brains. Most people aren't like that. Most prefer to use pleasure instead of pain to calm their brains. They don't care if a thing is "real" as long as it does its job. For the 'real' afficiandos pleasure doesn't work. That's why they disparage things that bring joy and peace to other people. Because those things simply don't work for them. The only thing that works is appropriate amount of suffering to make their brain accept the stuff they are doing, that's not any more real or interesting for the average person.

Have you noticed how a huge variety of things can be "real"? And the only unifying factor is the suffering? I think it's because it's all about the suffering, not the narrations and the details.

edwardbernays · 7 months ago
Extremely myopic take. "Real" things can be just as pleasurable as not-"real" things, and not-"real" things can be just as painful. I don't even know by what criteria you're making these distinctions, but it has the smell of an embittered person.
edwardbernays commented on Problem solving using Markov chains (2007) [pdf]   math.uchicago.edu/~shmuel... · Posted by u/Alifatisk
Ma8ee · 8 months ago
That whole discussion is based on the assumption that commercial firms or nonprofits are better in some way than publicly funded research. That is the stupid neoliberal dogma that private and market economy always are better than things that are run by our elected officials. That dogma has to die.
edwardbernays · 8 months ago
Completely agree. Neoliberalism and its consequences have been a disaster for mankind.
edwardbernays commented on Problem solving using Markov chains (2007) [pdf]   math.uchicago.edu/~shmuel... · Posted by u/Alifatisk
pstuart · 7 months ago
> transparently accepted money from waymo to peddle propaganda

If transparent enough (and not from an abhorrent source), I'd be ok with his product. He's even allowed to make the occasional mistake as long as he properly owns up to it.

Theres been a lot of valuable learning from him and it would be a pity to dismiss it all over a single fumble.

edwardbernays · 8 months ago
Lying or misrepresenting a product for a paycheck is not a fumble. It's a propagandist making a bag. Once they have put effort into creating a polished piece of propaganda, which they then release, it can not be considered a fumble any longer. It is something that they endorse. If they rescind it within some critical window that meaningfully impacts their bottom-line, maybe then I can believe them. Otherwise? No, I see no reason to offer them the benefit of the doubt. There are many people doing actually good work. Veritasium is not unique in their content or quality. We should not reward propagandists.
edwardbernays commented on Problem solving using Markov chains (2007) [pdf]   math.uchicago.edu/~shmuel... · Posted by u/Alifatisk
rowanG077 · 8 months ago
You are essentially saying any creator that has ever done sponsored content becomes a creator non-grata. I somewhat disagree with that. Sponsored content is a perverse incentive but it's also important to understand that creators can pick and choose for what they make sponsored content. So if you have an ethical creator can create sponsored content of a product they agree is actually that good. Well now the question is "How can you tell". And I don't think you generally can. Some people are really good at lying. In the end it's really about do you trust this creator or not. Which is what's it's about regardless if they took a sponsorship or not.
edwardbernays · 8 months ago
Sponsored content is fine. Sponsored content with improper public disclosure, or with irresponsible claims that do not reflect reality, is not fine. Super simple standard: if they lie or substantively misrepresent for a sponsor, they can no longer be trusted.
edwardbernays commented on Problem solving using Markov chains (2007) [pdf]   math.uchicago.edu/~shmuel... · Posted by u/Alifatisk
tomrod · 8 months ago
Let's ignore FOSS contributions for a moment, which very much contradict your claim that private companies don't contribute research to the public.

Outside software technology: there is a series of papers from Grossman (going back to the 80s!) that analyzes basic versus applied research in a macroeconomic framework. Basic research _can_ be a public good, applied research can be crowded out. Combined with microeconomic research that monopolies can be dynamically efficient (investing in applied and basic R&D, like Bell Labs) and you get several examples and theories that contradict your statement that "there is no private market entity with an incentive to provide research to the public."

Another real world example in hardware that contradicts this claim is the evolution of building control systems. Before the advent of IOT, so, circa 1980s - 2010s, you saw increasing sharing and harmonization of competing electronics standards because it turned out to be more efficient to be modular, not have to re-hire subcontractors at exorbitant rates to maintain or replace components that go haywire, etc.

edwardbernays · 8 months ago
Including FOSS software is so wild in this conversation that it's ridiculous. You mean creating a product as a loss leader to get people into an ecosystem, farm social capital, create a sales funnel, or get free labor from the community to provide QA? The creation and release of software is NOWHERE NEAR the same category as "doing actual real scientific research" that it just smells of incredibly bad faith argumentation.

Economic analysis? Another intelligence product that requires essentially no staff, no actual R&D, no equipment besides computers? Brother, you have to be kidding me.

The hardware thing is just companies evolving to a shared standard.

Do you have even a little bit of a clue how hard it is to do good pharmacological research? Toxicological? Biological? Chemical? Physical? You have mentioned intelligence products with 0 investment cost and 0 risk of failure.

This is perhaps one of the most fart-sniffing tech-centric perspectives I have ever been exposed to. Go read some actual research by actual scientists and come back when you can tell me why, for instance, Eli Lilley would ever make their data or internal R&D public.

Jonas Salk did it. He is an extremely rare exception, and his incentive was public health. Notice that his incentive was markedly not financial.

Market entities with a financial incentive, whose entire business model and success is predicated on their unique R&D results, have 0 incentive to release research to the public.

edwardbernays commented on Problem solving using Markov chains (2007) [pdf]   math.uchicago.edu/~shmuel... · Posted by u/Alifatisk
tomrod · 7 months ago
In economics discussions regarding public funding policy, the concern of "crowding out" commercial firms or nonprofits is a real concern. It's definitely an observed, measured, and reported phenomenon.

In the end, incentives matter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowding_out_(economics)

edwardbernays · 7 months ago
There is no private market entity with an incentive to provide research to the public, so in this sense there is no crowding out. Providing research to the public enables the discovery of new products which would otherwise have not been created. Public research is a public good that makes our nation happier, healthier, and wealthier.
edwardbernays commented on Actions reflect your priorities   tombrady.com/posts/your-a... · Posted by u/pbardea
rsyring · 7 months ago
Actions reflect someone's priorities.

I don't want my son, who has narcolepsy, to be tired all the time.

But the medicine that helps him, Xyrem (GHB), is $20K a month.

Pay it, don't pay it, neither option truly reflects my priorities. It only reflects the hand I've been dealt by other people's priorities.

edwardbernays · 7 months ago
TWENTY thousand a month? Surely this is wrong. Even $2k is ridiculous, but that's just criminal. Honestly, at a certain point, you might consider learning organic chemistry just to synthesize it yourself. It's fairly easy using unwatched precursors.
edwardbernays commented on Most Illinois farmland is not owned by farmers   chicagotribune.com/2025/0... · Posted by u/NaOH
actionfromafar · 7 months ago
You jest, but the harsh truth is that almost no change in society is possible unless at least some of the societal elites are on the bandwagon.
edwardbernays · 7 months ago
It's both sardonic and genuine. If he's genuine, then I genuinely wish him the best luck. However, it is very hard for me to believe that any billionaire would ever do something generally disfavorable to the current billionaire class. It's even harder for me to believe that, if one of them was to do so, that it would not be for their own further gain, just to the detriment of their peer cohort. I'm a bit jaded from having been lied to too many times.

Again, however, if he is genuine: I genuinely wish him the best luck taking on his matched opponents.

edwardbernays commented on Most Illinois farmland is not owned by farmers   chicagotribune.com/2025/0... · Posted by u/NaOH
cozzyd · 7 months ago
Fortunately the Illinois governor can be counted on to take a stand against billionaires.
edwardbernays · 7 months ago
true, we wish this brave and powerful man the best of luck as he takes on his matched opponents: the people in his socioeconomic bracket. amen.
edwardbernays commented on Problem solving using Markov chains (2007) [pdf]   math.uchicago.edu/~shmuel... · Posted by u/Alifatisk
fn-mote · 7 months ago
Yesterday I was reading comments about how the market could pay for research and avoid the “distorting effects” of public funding.

Is there any way to get a better outcome for the public here, or is “do good stuff then sell out” the way it’s always going to be?

edwardbernays · 7 months ago
What distorting effects of public funding? What about the distortionary effects of the market? I'll offer the suggestion that what you read is brainrotting private market propaganda designed to erode the public institutions that make America happier, healthier, and wealthier.

u/edwardbernays

KarmaCake day110June 10, 2025View Original