Unlike any other previous Tesla, or for that matter any other previous electric car, this is a reasonable value proposition. Everyone is so busy panning the looks they are overlooking the utility of this truck. Even the Model 3 is expensive compared to its peers at $35k. This this is priced competitive with non-electric trucks, heck, it's priced extremely well versus electric trucks. A 6 seat truck with a 6.5 foot truck bed and a 3500 pound capacity for $40k is genuinely competitive with GM/ Ford, likewise $50k for a 4WD truck which tows 14k pounds is absolutely reasonable. Unless you are regularly driving more than 250 miles per day, being able to charge at home is way better than filling up at gas stations.
> Unless you are regularly driving more than 250 miles per day, being able to charge at home is way better than filling up at gas stations.
There's no way the Tesla truck gets 250 miles when loaded up with 3500 pounds or hauling a trailer. It's very unclear if the range is sufficient if you use this truck like an actual truck where you need those things. Similarly if you are using this as a work truck there's some poor design choices involved here, too. Like the inability to access the bed from the sides of the vehicle. Or the non-flat roof complicating roof racks or additional lighting.
This appears to be more of a "lifestyle" truck than a "work" truck, and in that market how important are the extra cargo pounds or trailer capacity?
Work trucks are those plain white base model trucks with steel wheels and plastic interiors. You get them cheap and they will basically approve anyone for cheap financing of a few trucks through their business. Nobody is catering to those buyers when they design a truck. You look at those things on the lot and they look like one of the nicer trucks except only partially assembled.
The $50k trucks are basically for suburban dads. They used to drive luxury sedans while their wives drove minivans. Now the dads drive trucks that have replaced the minivan and the moms drive luxury SUVs. Trucks need to fit 6+ people, have nice interiors and enough space for hauling kids' sports gear and Home Depot stuff on the weekends. The Cybertruck is perfect for this segment. Fits 6 people, has plenty of hauling capacity and will take down a Ferrari in the 1/4 mile.
Let's be honest, this truck won't replace Chevy/Ram/Ford trucks on work sites. This truck will primarily be used to haul mountain bikes, soccer equipment and the occasional run to Home Depot.
> in that market how important are the extra cargo pounds or trailer capacity?
Not really important. What's important is that it _look_ like it can haul stuff. Like most Ford F-1-2-whatevers, Rams and other pickups, most of the time they're empty and car-wash clean.
I actually like the looks of the Tesla pickup. It's about time they went more avant-garde with their designs. This is supposed to be the future, dammit, Mr Musk's other company makes spaceships. Why NOT futuristic cars instead of Lexus look-alikes?
You don't get anywhere near rated milage/ range on a normal truck when hauling loads either. The truth is even for work trucks, most trucks spend 80+% of the time lightly loaded or empty.
The issue with lumber racks and the apparent inability to haul larger items is a much bigger concern for "Work Trucks".
I see this as something which I can haul 3-4 friends and their bikes up to the trailhead in (or skiing/ camping/ fishing) and it seems pretty reasonably set up for that.
BTW, you're ignoring potentially huge cost savings with gas. Trucks are notoriously gas guzzling, many people spending 2-500 a month in gas. Cost would drop dramatically if you could plugin every night and wake up with a full 'tank'.
Trucks are gas guzzlers as compared to gas sedans. There’s no reason an electric truck of similar utility wouldn’t be similarly an electricity guzzler without making some sacrifices. The only benefit is that all-electric brings significant torque improvements even at low horsepower, but with modern turbochargers low-rpm torque has long been solved (my 2.0T sedan can tow!) and people won’t stop “horsepower shopping” just because the torque numbers are high as it’s mainly for bragging rights anyway.
Eh, doesn't have to be this way. What we need are smaller, lighter trucks; this message seems to have been missed by Ford who have released a new Ranger that's bigger than the F150 used to be.
This isn't something I'm ignoring, not having to deal with fuel ups and maintenance is one of the big reasons I've wanted to buy an electric car for several years. But every time I've priced a Tesla in the past, the premium for electric has been too high for me. That's what really caught my eye about this.
If this had been available 3 years ago when I bought my truck it would have been an instant purchase. As it is, I'm likely to sell my current truck and buy this when it comes out.
12000 miles a year at 13mpg and 2.5$ gas is $2308 per year. With a 5 year ownership time you are saving only [$11500-charging electricity costs]. So mid range $57000 AWD becomes $45500. Still pricey for most people.
I'd rather them come out with totally utilitarian bare bones truck but with the range and basic capabilities for $25K or so. THAT would be a game changer in the SUV/Truck space.
I didn't like the looks of this thing when I saw it, probably because it looks so different.
But after appreciating all the awesome engineering that went into it, I find myself loving the scifi look. Finally a vehicle designed for geeks like me. I had always thought it sad that stainless steel vehicles never caught on. Here's my chance, and built from the same material as a space ship, that's icing on the cake. This is for sure my next vehicle.
Not if you have to do a number of laps, though. Heat issues, etc. - the M3 is nearly track ready off the lot, the Tesla is really just a luxury car that happens to go fast from time to time.
Is the base Model 3 giving the BMW M3 a run for its money, or a higher end Model 3?
Regardless, the M3 isn't exactly the pinnacle of bang-for-your-buck speed. You are paying a big premium on the BMW for fit & finish which is miles ahead of the Model 3.
But when I wrote about the pricing on the Model 3 I was thinking more in terms of utility, not pure performance. If the job to be done is driving to work, the M3 isn't the car I'm looking at. It's the Honda Civic.
When I’m hauling around a 10,000 pound airstream trailer on highways that 500 miles becomes 250 and 250 becomes 125 on flat land. Now consider going uphill on mountains and the range drops even more. There’s a real possibility of being stranded with no place left to charge in the middle of nowhere where I could be easily killed without anyone even knowing.
I don't think it's as extreme as you're making it seem. Going uphill on mountains means you're going downhill which not only doesn't use power but regenerates power to the battery. It's obviously not insignificant of a cost but adding a trailer doesn't immediately halve the usable range.
Towing puts a toll on any vehicle's gas mileage, and you can run out of gas in a normal truck too. Tesla's have range indicators built in and let you know how far you are from the nearest charging station. Turns out people who are traveling pay at least a little attention to vehicle range, particularly when hauling a load. This isn't unique to electric vehicles, regular trucks fuel economy goes way down with a load as well and gas stations are often few and far between in the mountains.
Several of Musk's numbers don't add up. No pickup has a bed capacity of 3500 pounds. That's 1.75 tons. Even full sized US pickups top out at 3/4 ton, unless they're super duty which adds greatly to weight and lowers MPG painfully. A 1.75 ton load, especially raised as high up as shown in this prototype, would flip the truck in the slightest of turns. 3500 is surely a fake number.
Second, this is going to be a very heavy truck, 6000 pounds or more. No truck with thick stainless steel body panels can weigh less than 5500 pounds. How that much weight can deliver 250 to 500 miles of range... sounds like fantasy #2. Apparently Musk is imagining that battery technology will advance a lot before this thing ships. Or he's just making stuff up.
Finally, the claim that the bed will extend to the ground to form a useful ramp. Nah. These folks have never lived with a pickup. No object heavier than a bicycle is going to make it up that 45 degree incline and into the bed without crashing into the cab before it can stop, especially given the polished floor of the demo truck. That's fantasy #3. No telling how much more reality distortion lies beneath that funky exterior.
> How that much weight can deliver 250 to 500 miles of range... sounds like fantasy #2.
This falls into the category of put up or shut up. Tesla has bad track record of hitting deadlines, but a really good track record of hitting their range estimates. If they don't hit 250 miles on the base model, we're sure to hear about it when it's launched.
> Finally, the claim that the bed will extend to the ground to form a useful ramp. Nah. These folks have never lived with a pickup.
If you don't see the value in being able to tilt the truck bed then you've clearly never used a pickup to it's capacity.
I've bought 4 major appliances lately and hauled several tons of lumber, concrete, & gravel. Even without the ramps, Being able to tilt the bed down to unload the truck sounds like a fucking godsend to me. Particularly for loose loads and lumber where it would act a bit like a dump truck.
> A 1.75 ton load, especially raised as high up as shown in this prototype, would flip the truck in the slightest of turns.
The battery in this truck is probably incredibly heavy, which really moves the center of mass down. The suspension is also computer controlled, and at high loads you could lower the vehicle to be closer to the ground. Carrying 3500 pounds off road isn't a good idea even if the vehicle can corner so you don't need the clearance.
Actually I think your overestimating the total weight, but it goes to the above point when you say
> Second, this is going to be a very heavy truck, 6000 pounds or more.
> Musk is imagining that battery technology will advance a lot before this thing ships
Unlikely, more likely he is just planning on putting a lot of battery in it. Unlike you, Musk has lots of engineers working on this and has a pretty damn good idea of what is possible.
Pickup trucks are ideal for packing a lot of battery, lots of space along the bottom to do so.
> Finally, the claim that the bed will extend to the ground to form a useful ramp. Nah. These folks have never lived with a pickup. No object heavier than a bicycle is going to make it up that 45 degree incline and into the bed without crashing into the cab before it can stop, especially given the polished floor of the demo truck. That's fantasy #3. No telling how much more reality distortion lies beneath that funky exterior.
ROFL - you realized they literally live demoed doing so on a ATV right?
Moreover, the main use of ramps, at least in my mind having unloaded and loaded a pickup truck, is making it easier to move heavy objects in and out by hand.
I'm pretty sure the only person fantasizing here is you.
I know a lot of folks are walking away from the puzzling aesthetic but I think that’s the point. Existing Tesla owners with a taste for existing design cues won’t push Tesla sales any further. They’ve got to expand the demographic and this design has a chance to do this.
Think of all the wrangler, hummer, truck buyers who want a militaristic, rough, unpolished steel look and this is that flavor taken to an extreme.
Other buyers still have the S3XYs to choose from so we can all have our favorite toys from the same company. No cannibalization.
Whether people may like this exterior design or not, it's a display of bravery from Tesla to steer away from old conventional shapes and forms. Strong innovative design deviations like this should be praised.
my assumption was that people who ride this kind of car want to stand out in the first place. Most pick up trucks and other kind of trucks all look pretty weird like the slideshow at the start. Square cars, weird dimensions, etc. I think they're appealing to the right demographic here
This thing looks like straight out of a sci-fi movie. I think the aesthetic is going to get them a lot of sales. If I had use for a car, this would be at the very top of my list, purely based on the looks.
I hated it at first. But the more I look at it, the more I like it. It's crazy and totally memeable, like a cross between Guy Fieri, Cosmo Kramer, and Jeff Goldblum.
I bet they'll get a ton of sales from people buying it ironically. Which, when you think about it, is why many people buy trucks in the first place - very few are buying it for utility.
Yup. You need to apply only very little imagination here - this is just a paint job away from designs used in half of the sci-fi series of the last 20 years.
You also need to look at the Eastern market - Chinese/Middle East markets are apparently what is driving the outrageous size of BMW's grills, and many other extreme design elements currently en vogue.
In the Middle East the Land Cruiser V8 is king. It's not because of looks (although IMO they don't look bad), but what it can do.
Can you use this to overtake someone on the hard shoulder (half covered in sand) and go bumming around sand dunes? That's what Tesla have got to do to win there.
Flat panel is what trucks have needed to go back to. Get a bad dent or the garbage is rusting out? Cut it out and weld some sheet on top. No need buy an entire door or go to a body shop.
This is the first time I have seen a production vehicle's design to be less realistic (in terms of usability, component reuse, artistic freedom, etc) than it's artistic renders.
Here's a few artist imagined renders, and to be honest, they would be a lot less likely to get an April 1st calendar check reaction:
Whether it looks hideous or not would still depend on personal preferences though. I like the fact that it looks, well like a concept car, but it isn't.
The divisiveness of this design is precisely what will propel its success. It's the coolest production car I've ever seen. And I expect >50% of the population to strongly disagree, mostly people from different generations. "Appalling" designs get free viral marketing; the trick is to still appeal to enough of your target market.
This truck gets attention. It's a loud status statement that looks cheap to build, costs less than $50k. Well done Tesla.
This thread already has more comments than anything I've seen in months. The design is absolutely doing its job as a marketing tool.
Some people will love it, some people will hate it, a lot of people are probably just kind of confounded by it but will come to like it after they see a few in person.
Either way it's absolutely dominating a news cycle, which isn't easy to do.
I actually like this design because it's not the same old boring style of nearly every other vehicle these days, but I've always been pretty nonconformist.
What really stood out to me is the truck bed and the way the ramp pulls (or folds?) out. It actually seems very sensible and well designed, despite looking like it's trying too hard to be different.
And the sides of the bed of the truck come down at an angle so you can't lean over the side to grab something out of the bed or sit on the side of the bed. Strapping things down at an angle like that will be difficult as well.
It's tough in unimportant ways but weak when it comes to the bed which is arguably the most important feature of a truck.
I think this vehicle is better described as a crossover. For a crossover its not as ugly to me because I'm not hung up on the design decision to neuter the bed. But as a truck it looks like they chose a really terrible looking form over function.
I'd buy this one in a minute if I had the need for a truck. It's so beautiful. I totally dig into this retro futuristic design. Wish they made a car like that. Tesla is killing it.
I absolutely love the design! It's so new, so unique, and so bold where as I am not certain I'd be able to tell a ford a chevy and a ram apart without their logos
Don't be ridiculous. The US has no pedestrian safety standards whatsoever. In a sane world, the NHTSA would have outlawed bull bars and required trucks to have sideguards.
That was my immediate thought. Granted, I've not watched the video as I'm at work so if it was covered then I've not seen it, but that thing looks like it has absolutely no crumple zones, and the lack of curved surfaces would cause horrific injury in a pedestrian collision.
Tesla Model S and 3 in terms of collision safety are the safest cars ever sold in America. There is a giant crumple zone where the engine would be in an ICE vehicle. The Cybertruck will be the same.
Not meant to be mainstream. It's meant to be f'ing tough and show how much of a beast the electric vehicle can be. Really takes the air out of being 'Built Ford Tough' Likely just following the Roadster play book. Get the toughness doubters out of the way, then a more traditional truck to follow.
Does it not being mainstream even matter, though? Because at least here in AU, and I believe in the EU, to even register it as roadworthy it needs to not compromise its collision protection which includes pedestrian collisions.
I guess it’s a good thing that trucks like this aren’t really a thing in the EU.
They exist, but I don’t know anyone who has ever owned or rented one. They’re hard to find, dealerships don’t tend to have them so you’d have to find a specialist importer I reckon.
Tesla pedestrian collision warning is dangerously ineffective. It passes some tests with flying colors and completely fails other pedestrian safety tests.
Sure, but a manufacturer couldn't sell a car with a solid steel bumper. In the US you have lots of freedom to modify your car after you buy it, but manufacturers have strict regulations.
>Does the US not have pedestrian safety standards?
I don't know what it is like outside of the United States but here everyone has the common sense to know "don't walk in front of moving vehicles" as you are taught as a child "look both ways before crossing" over and over and over.
You can put all of safety features you want on a vehicle, but if they hit a pedestrian there is a VERY good chance they will die. That's a lot of force and a little bit of rubber or plastic won't make a lot of difference, I say this as someone that lost a very dear friend to a hit and run as a pedestrian and lost another friend this year that was stationary on her motorcycle and someone rear-ended her and killed her (effectively) instantly.
As a truck guy who has owned a lot of trucks and currently owns a 2017 Ram 2500 CTD 4x4 and a Land Rover Defender 110, I'm telling you right now: this is going to kill it. This is the suburban status item of 2022.
I want to buy this right now. This has nearly the towing capacity of my Ram and will smoke my wife's Audi on the track.
> As a truck guy who has owned a lot of trucks and currently owns a 2017 Ram 2500 CTD 4x4 and a Land Rover Defender 110, I'm telling you right now: this is going to kill it.
We'll see.
If it does kill, the looks won't be a problem, they'll be an asset - a more extreme version of the Prius.
But if it doesn't, a lot of people will blame the look.
This demographic will love the look. Have you seen pickups lately? The Big 3 have been chasing an industrial aesthetic for years. This was a very bold move and I feel very strongly that this will shake up the market.
The specs are a truck lover's dream. Most pickups are driving office dudes like me to our office jobs every day. We hate the gas mileage but we love the look and we want something powerful enough to tow the boat or ATV hauler on the weekends. This truck claims it can do that AND beat a Porsche off the traffic light AND never have to visit a fuel pump again.
Do people in the rural/suburban US really tow that much that often? Seeing the number of trucks just doesn’t make sense (especially given how few are towing anything). Is there a little measure of lifestyle signaling or macho involved in truck ownership, or towing capacity comparison?
Car companies don't limit themselves to selling people a car based on what their life is like now, people have already got something that lets them do the things they currently do.
They can market it based on what their life could be like if they brought the car. Perhaps in vague, emotional terms.
You too could be kayaking/mountain biking/skiing through picturesque countryside with your pretty, athletic friends... if you buy a Brand X SUV. Be confident in any situation. Whatever, wherever, whenever. Adventure starts here. Built tough. Driven by dreams. Past the pavement. Built for city roads and no roads.
I know several people with campers, horse trailers, car trailers, boats, etc. Most aren’t maxing out their towing capacity, but if you’re driving through any mountains, you’ll want to be well within those limits unless you want a white knuckle experience.
I have a Silverado diesel truck which I inherited. I don't tow often, but I do use it a lot for landscaping work -- hauling mulch, brick, and lumber in and yard waste out to the recycling center.
Its going to sell well, like every Tesla. I suspect that it won't sell well to people who buy trucks for their actual utility, but you're right that this thing will totally be a status symbol; just not among people who would utilize its capabilities.
Just look at the success of the G-Wagon among white LA uurbanite-types. No one cares about the utility. It just looks weird and gives off this vibe of "I work! Trust me! Look at my utilitarian car!" That's who this will sell to, and it will sell well.
The G-Wagon is a very high end luxury SUV with a huge profit margin. As such, MB can afford to sell only a handful. But at the advertised price, the Cybertruck offers no such margin. It'll surely will be a money-loser for Tesla which they'll have to sell like F150s for a decade just to break even.
The Cybertruck isn't about profit. It's about making Tesla's name synonymous with shock and awe.
I also consider myself a "truck guy". In my entire life, I've owned a single car. I had it for about a year when I got up one morning, drove to the dealership, bought a new Dodge (basically the same as yours, except 1500), and told the girlfriend she could have the car (hers had seen better days).
I would not be caught dead in one of these.
(Disclaimer: I'm a Harley riding country boy from the midwest, probably not Tesla's major demographic anyways!)
The vast majority of SUVs and trucks are bought to signal some sort of status or affiliation to a group. Just look at how clean these vehicles are. And some of the brands. Porsche SUV. Mercedes pickup.
The people who actual use these class of vehicles for real have mud splashed over the vehicle and extra cans of petrol. They aren’t going to buy an unproven vehicle that you can’t refuel.
They’ll probably make a killing with the Cybertruck.
I am not sure if this will become a status symbol, but I 100% agree that that is the market it is going for.
I know three people who own a pickup (one in commercial construction, one who is a big animal vet, and one who has a horse farm). This does not appear to be designed for those people at all.
However, I think it could appeal to the same people who wanted a hummer. Driving it is just overtly confrontational. It will be fascinating to see whether there is a market for exactly this though, because Tesla is supposed to be environmentally friendly, and the people who bought hummers clearly didn't care about that (at the time, at least).
Your wife drives an Audi that can't do better than 0-60 in 6.5 seconds?
Also.. tracks have turns. Low center of gravity helps, but this thing will probably weigh 3-4x as much as a sporty car. Even the Model S has weight comparable to a minivan. My guess is a Subaru BRZ could beat this around many tracks.
This is a cool truck and all, and I hope Tesla makes more exciting designs like this, but I'm tired of people thinking that Teslas are performance cars just because they have torque. Tesla has yet to make anything that interests me at the prices they charge.
>>Your wife drives an Audi that can't do better than 0-60 in 6.5 seconds?
How is that surprising? Unless you go for the really expensive ones with top-spec engines, you're normally looking at 7-8s to 60mph. As an example, the Q3 can be had with 6 different engines, and only the range-topping 45 TFSI breaks the 6.5s barrier at 6.3s to 60mph. All other engines are slower.
A1 can be had with 3 different engines, and the fastest one does 0-60 in 7.7s.
Really, the only Audi where <6.5s to 60mph is "standard" is the A8, with the slowest engine being the 50 TDI that does 0-60 in 5.9s. The second model in line, the A7, starts with a 40TDI that does 0-60 in 8.3 seconds.
At 6000 pounds and a high CoG, this thing is going to handle worse than most ladder frame trucks. And that's bad.
It's also going to have truly awful front and rear visibility. Long windshields are invariably difficult to live with, creating a hothouse interior on any day without clouds. Once you add appendages to make this legal (side mirrors, rear center brake and tail lights, headlights and turn signals) much of the bold charm of the original concept truck (which is all this is) will be lost.
I agree the design is refreshingly bold. But lots of concept cars in the past initially took fans by storm only to fade into the mainstream by the time they shipped. I'll be very impressed if a design this striking can maintain its visual impact all the way through production.
Love it or hate it seems to be the case here - not many fence sitters. Been reading TMC and FB Tesla Owners group the past hour and reactions are I’d estimate about 80% negative.
I agree and think this could possibly replace many SUVs in suburban areas. 6 person seating is another great selling point for many, just look at all of the third row vehicles like the Honda Pilot. The base price of the Cybertruck is similar to a Pilot. Which would you rather drive?
isn't the electric-grid dependency completely antithetical to the ownership of an off-road, off-civilization vehicle ?
(also, honestly this design is a fugly tin can. Elon musk is generally going through a tin can phase (starship etc)). I wouldn't bet on many sales for this, but it's still interesting to see something so different
500 miles is fairly substantial range. I can see this being useful for a very wide variety of use cases, but obviously not those longer-term multi-day excursions into the wilderness.
That said, it is a truck, and maybe someone (perhaps even Tesla) will develop a modular LNG/propane/diesel generator unit you can put into the back of the truck for purposes of range extension. I realize this is inefficient, not environmentally friendly, and going in the opposite direction of what the electric car is supposed to do, but its also only applicable in those extreme edge cases where you need to be away from the grid for days or weeks.
Is this satire or are rich car people really this insufferable? This may be the best/worst comment I've ever seen here. The level of status projecting and suburban truck guy cringe is through the roof.
I think it looks pretty awesome. The ATV that charges in the back as the "oh, and one more thing" moment was also great. I can see this being very popular. There is something very masculine and forward looking about the design. The interior shots on the website are also impressive-- I wonder why they didn't show that tonight in the demo (probably it's just a rendering and the prototype version has a bare-bones interior). The glass breaking was tough to watch though-- I'm sure it threw him off during the rest of the presentation.
Skip to around 15 minutes in unless you like watching terrible smartphone footage of a bunch of people standing around waiting for the truck to turn up.
I wonder if they cut the presentation a little short because of the glass issue . Then again, Musk isn't exactly the greatest presenter so I don't think he could play off someone talking in his ear to cut it short.
As the current owner of a 2017 F150 long bed 4x4 with an ARE bed cap, I'm super-tempted by the Tesla. It's a total no-brainer for the people buying things like the Honda Ridgeline. It's less so for people who treat their truck like a work vehicle.
Frankly, I don't think will cannibalize the existing P/U market as much as it will sway more people away from SUVs into [Cyber]trucks, especially if the back seat is as spacious as a normal full size truck's.
It has a 6.5' bed, and I look at the bed to judge whether it's used as a truck or not. Shortbeds are unusable and nearly useless for any real work. They're so frustrating, that I don't even consider a shortbed truck a truck at all. It's a family sedan masquerading as one. Tesla very wisely delivered a real truck.
The only thing the Cybertruck needs is more colors. It's a little odd looking, like Robocop is coming to town, but it's time for changes in the market. The Model 3 converted me to viewing existing cars as dinosaurs, and this will probably transform the truck market as well.
I grew up working on a farm, and while I'm a developer today, I still get my hands dirty. I'm in for one.
6.5' is a short bed, though - it's the same length as most short-bed full-size 1/2 or 3/4 ton pickups.
It's only a "long bed" when you compare it to midsize trucks like the Tacoma or Ridgeline, which is what this vehicle really is more akin to (especially the first generation Ridgeline, as you can't replace the bed on the Cybertruck or the old Ridgeline as it was a part of the unibody - not good when you accidentally overload or bend up the bed, unfortunately).
Curious to see what the production version ends up like, but I don't know if this is really going to be taken seriously by people who need a "real" truck, at least in the current form. It's more of a weekend warrior vehicle right now, I'd say
I had a short-bed diesel for 5 years or so, and put it to plenty of use. Yes, it's not ideal for common dimensions of lumber (but you can just pop the tailgate down and put some little red flags on stuff), but it will still haul tons of random things (for me: large trash dump runs, car engines on stands, a set of 16 car tires, several 55 gallon drums, a full bucketload of topsoil, a pallet of landscaping rock, etc). IMHO, a short-bed truck is still a truck.
Given the sledgehammer test, at least from the side that thing will be very aggressive in a crash. As in, if it runs into you, or if you run into it you will be more injured and/or dead. You generally want a little give on the road in both directions.
It's more than a belief... the statistics bear it out.
"The lowest 2015 death rate by vehicle type is for very large SUVs: 13 deaths per million registered vehicles. The highest is for mini cars: 64 deaths per million registered vehicles."
https://www.edmunds.com/car-safety/are-smaller-cars-as-safe-...
I think a perception of additional personal safety is definitely a reason people like SUVs.
But you can be super safe while still helping protect your crash partners. You can often improve both your and your crash partner's safety with more crumple zones.
I don't think the patrons of this thing are going to be thinking about this much.
Readit News
There's no way the Tesla truck gets 250 miles when loaded up with 3500 pounds or hauling a trailer. It's very unclear if the range is sufficient if you use this truck like an actual truck where you need those things. Similarly if you are using this as a work truck there's some poor design choices involved here, too. Like the inability to access the bed from the sides of the vehicle. Or the non-flat roof complicating roof racks or additional lighting.
This appears to be more of a "lifestyle" truck than a "work" truck, and in that market how important are the extra cargo pounds or trailer capacity?
The $50k trucks are basically for suburban dads. They used to drive luxury sedans while their wives drove minivans. Now the dads drive trucks that have replaced the minivan and the moms drive luxury SUVs. Trucks need to fit 6+ people, have nice interiors and enough space for hauling kids' sports gear and Home Depot stuff on the weekends. The Cybertruck is perfect for this segment. Fits 6 people, has plenty of hauling capacity and will take down a Ferrari in the 1/4 mile.
Not really important. What's important is that it _look_ like it can haul stuff. Like most Ford F-1-2-whatevers, Rams and other pickups, most of the time they're empty and car-wash clean.
I actually like the looks of the Tesla pickup. It's about time they went more avant-garde with their designs. This is supposed to be the future, dammit, Mr Musk's other company makes spaceships. Why NOT futuristic cars instead of Lexus look-alikes?
The issue with lumber racks and the apparent inability to haul larger items is a much bigger concern for "Work Trucks".
I see this as something which I can haul 3-4 friends and their bikes up to the trailhead in (or skiing/ camping/ fishing) and it seems pretty reasonably set up for that.
If this had been available 3 years ago when I bought my truck it would have been an instant purchase. As it is, I'm likely to sell my current truck and buy this when it comes out.
I'd rather them come out with totally utilitarian bare bones truck but with the range and basic capabilities for $25K or so. THAT would be a game changer in the SUV/Truck space.
But after appreciating all the awesome engineering that went into it, I find myself loving the scifi look. Finally a vehicle designed for geeks like me. I had always thought it sad that stainless steel vehicles never caught on. Here's my chance, and built from the same material as a space ship, that's icing on the cake. This is for sure my next vehicle.
I thought I read around a track, the Model 3 gives a BMW M3 (which is $60k-$80k) a run for its money.
The model 3 performance holds it's own.. for two laps until it reduces power for being too hot.
Still super impressive but if you're a track die-hard and have the money, it looks like the new Porsche EV will have a leg up there.
Regardless, the M3 isn't exactly the pinnacle of bang-for-your-buck speed. You are paying a big premium on the BMW for fit & finish which is miles ahead of the Model 3.
But when I wrote about the pricing on the Model 3 I was thinking more in terms of utility, not pure performance. If the job to be done is driving to work, the M3 isn't the car I'm looking at. It's the Honda Civic.
Well, that escalated quickly.
Second, this is going to be a very heavy truck, 6000 pounds or more. No truck with thick stainless steel body panels can weigh less than 5500 pounds. How that much weight can deliver 250 to 500 miles of range... sounds like fantasy #2. Apparently Musk is imagining that battery technology will advance a lot before this thing ships. Or he's just making stuff up.
Finally, the claim that the bed will extend to the ground to form a useful ramp. Nah. These folks have never lived with a pickup. No object heavier than a bicycle is going to make it up that 45 degree incline and into the bed without crashing into the cab before it can stop, especially given the polished floor of the demo truck. That's fantasy #3. No telling how much more reality distortion lies beneath that funky exterior.
If they don't, then they will need to be revised before release and we can discuss them at that time.
> No pickup has a bed capacity of 3500 pounds.
Nonsense. Super Duty trucks have payload capacities up to 7,850 lbs. Even a ford F150 with a V6 has a capacity near a ton and they only go up from there. https://www.fordf150blog.com/2019-f-150-towing-and-payload-c...
> How that much weight can deliver 250 to 500 miles of range... sounds like fantasy #2.
This falls into the category of put up or shut up. Tesla has bad track record of hitting deadlines, but a really good track record of hitting their range estimates. If they don't hit 250 miles on the base model, we're sure to hear about it when it's launched.
> Finally, the claim that the bed will extend to the ground to form a useful ramp. Nah. These folks have never lived with a pickup.
If you don't see the value in being able to tilt the truck bed then you've clearly never used a pickup to it's capacity.
I've bought 4 major appliances lately and hauled several tons of lumber, concrete, & gravel. Even without the ramps, Being able to tilt the bed down to unload the truck sounds like a fucking godsend to me. Particularly for loose loads and lumber where it would act a bit like a dump truck.
The battery in this truck is probably incredibly heavy, which really moves the center of mass down. The suspension is also computer controlled, and at high loads you could lower the vehicle to be closer to the ground. Carrying 3500 pounds off road isn't a good idea even if the vehicle can corner so you don't need the clearance.
Actually I think your overestimating the total weight, but it goes to the above point when you say
> Second, this is going to be a very heavy truck, 6000 pounds or more.
> Musk is imagining that battery technology will advance a lot before this thing ships
Unlikely, more likely he is just planning on putting a lot of battery in it. Unlike you, Musk has lots of engineers working on this and has a pretty damn good idea of what is possible.
Pickup trucks are ideal for packing a lot of battery, lots of space along the bottom to do so.
> Finally, the claim that the bed will extend to the ground to form a useful ramp. Nah. These folks have never lived with a pickup. No object heavier than a bicycle is going to make it up that 45 degree incline and into the bed without crashing into the cab before it can stop, especially given the polished floor of the demo truck. That's fantasy #3. No telling how much more reality distortion lies beneath that funky exterior.
ROFL - you realized they literally live demoed doing so on a ATV right?
Moreover, the main use of ramps, at least in my mind having unloaded and loaded a pickup truck, is making it easier to move heavy objects in and out by hand.
I'm pretty sure the only person fantasizing here is you.
Think of all the wrangler, hummer, truck buyers who want a militaristic, rough, unpolished steel look and this is that flavor taken to an extreme.
Other buyers still have the S3XYs to choose from so we can all have our favorite toys from the same company. No cannibalization.
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This thing looks like straight out of a sci-fi movie. I think the aesthetic is going to get them a lot of sales. If I had use for a car, this would be at the very top of my list, purely based on the looks.
I bet they'll get a ton of sales from people buying it ironically. Which, when you think about it, is why many people buy trucks in the first place - very few are buying it for utility.
In static images, it looks ugly, but in videos, it looks awesome.
Maybe it's because of the extremely minimal design, and as someone said in these comments, it lacks any features at all.
One thing though, you have to give Elon the credit to travel down the road less traveled.
In fact it's made with the same steel alloy. I think I want to buy one now.
Can you use this to overtake someone on the hard shoulder (half covered in sand) and go bumming around sand dunes? That's what Tesla have got to do to win there.
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What do those words mean? Google Image Search isn't helping.
This thing alienates far more than it attracts in the pickup truck market.
I love the fact that Tesla are moving away from the boring, middle of the road designs of their previous models.
But this.... this is just hideous.
It doesn’t look tough or futuristic; it looks like something a 10 year old designed, and no, that’s not a good thing.
Here's a few artist imagined renders, and to be honest, they would be a lot less likely to get an April 1st calendar check reaction:
- https://inteng-storage.s3.amazonaws.com/img/iea/JYG0mpkD61/s...
- https://www.teslarati.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/tesla-p...
Whether it looks hideous or not would still depend on personal preferences though. I like the fact that it looks, well like a concept car, but it isn't.
This truck gets attention. It's a loud status statement that looks cheap to build, costs less than $50k. Well done Tesla.
Some people will love it, some people will hate it, a lot of people are probably just kind of confounded by it but will come to like it after they see a few in person.
Either way it's absolutely dominating a news cycle, which isn't easy to do.
Out of curiosity, which generations? I'm in my 20s and most of the friends Ive talked to think it's comically ugly.
What really stood out to me is the truck bed and the way the ramp pulls (or folds?) out. It actually seems very sensible and well designed, despite looking like it's trying too hard to be different.
It's tough in unimportant ways but weak when it comes to the bed which is arguably the most important feature of a truck.
I think this vehicle is better described as a crossover. For a crossover its not as ugly to me because I'm not hung up on the design decision to neuter the bed. But as a truck it looks like they chose a really terrible looking form over function.
You can’t use it as a work truck as when you damage something, the part will take 3 years to arrive.
Good thing is: You won't have to buy it.
Yeah that's for Elon's other company.
How the tables turn.
More than ugly, it looks like a parody.
I can only assume this is a joke and in a few hours Elon will do a "one more thing" before showing the real Tesla Pickup.
This take on a pickup looks like some engineer accidentally left their Halo fan-art on the shared CAD file server.
but nope, apparently not. https://usa.streetsblog.org/2017/12/07/while-other-countries...
They exist, but I don’t know anyone who has ever owned or rented one. They’re hard to find, dealerships don’t tend to have them so you’d have to find a specialist importer I reckon.
I don't think I've ever actually seen what Americans call a 'truck' on a street in Europe.
(Slight exaggeration, but not really.)
And anyway, I'm not sure why an all metal grill would be worse than the grill guard (cow catcher) already present on a lot of trucks.
Plays into the inconsistent nature of autopilot.
I don't know what it is like outside of the United States but here everyone has the common sense to know "don't walk in front of moving vehicles" as you are taught as a child "look both ways before crossing" over and over and over.
You can put all of safety features you want on a vehicle, but if they hit a pedestrian there is a VERY good chance they will die. That's a lot of force and a little bit of rubber or plastic won't make a lot of difference, I say this as someone that lost a very dear friend to a hit and run as a pedestrian and lost another friend this year that was stationary on her motorcycle and someone rear-ended her and killed her (effectively) instantly.
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Yes we do, get out of the way.
Outside of major cities there are almost no pedestrians in the US, the only time people walk in the US is when our car/truck is broken..
and with Uber we do not even have to do that now... Technology is great :)
I want to buy this right now. This has nearly the towing capacity of my Ram and will smoke my wife's Audi on the track.
We'll see.
If it does kill, the looks won't be a problem, they'll be an asset - a more extreme version of the Prius.
But if it doesn't, a lot of people will blame the look.
The specs are a truck lover's dream. Most pickups are driving office dudes like me to our office jobs every day. We hate the gas mileage but we love the look and we want something powerful enough to tow the boat or ATV hauler on the weekends. This truck claims it can do that AND beat a Porsche off the traffic light AND never have to visit a fuel pump again.
They can market it based on what their life could be like if they brought the car. Perhaps in vague, emotional terms.
You too could be kayaking/mountain biking/skiing through picturesque countryside with your pretty, athletic friends... if you buy a Brand X SUV. Be confident in any situation. Whatever, wherever, whenever. Adventure starts here. Built tough. Driven by dreams. Past the pavement. Built for city roads and no roads.
Just look at the success of the G-Wagon among white LA uurbanite-types. No one cares about the utility. It just looks weird and gives off this vibe of "I work! Trust me! Look at my utilitarian car!" That's who this will sell to, and it will sell well.
The Cybertruck isn't about profit. It's about making Tesla's name synonymous with shock and awe.
I also consider myself a "truck guy". In my entire life, I've owned a single car. I had it for about a year when I got up one morning, drove to the dealership, bought a new Dodge (basically the same as yours, except 1500), and told the girlfriend she could have the car (hers had seen better days).
I would not be caught dead in one of these.
(Disclaimer: I'm a Harley riding country boy from the midwest, probably not Tesla's major demographic anyways!)
In other words you overbought and don't use the diesel or the 3/4 ton frame? Because this is definitely NOT a replacement for that.
The people who actual use these class of vehicles for real have mud splashed over the vehicle and extra cans of petrol. They aren’t going to buy an unproven vehicle that you can’t refuel.
They’ll probably make a killing with the Cybertruck.
I think you just described 80% of truck owners.
This truck is no Dodge Dakota. This sits between a half-ton and 3/4-ton truck.
I know three people who own a pickup (one in commercial construction, one who is a big animal vet, and one who has a horse farm). This does not appear to be designed for those people at all.
However, I think it could appeal to the same people who wanted a hummer. Driving it is just overtly confrontational. It will be fascinating to see whether there is a market for exactly this though, because Tesla is supposed to be environmentally friendly, and the people who bought hummers clearly didn't care about that (at the time, at least).
Also.. tracks have turns. Low center of gravity helps, but this thing will probably weigh 3-4x as much as a sporty car. Even the Model S has weight comparable to a minivan. My guess is a Subaru BRZ could beat this around many tracks.
This is a cool truck and all, and I hope Tesla makes more exciting designs like this, but I'm tired of people thinking that Teslas are performance cars just because they have torque. Tesla has yet to make anything that interests me at the prices they charge.
How is that surprising? Unless you go for the really expensive ones with top-spec engines, you're normally looking at 7-8s to 60mph. As an example, the Q3 can be had with 6 different engines, and only the range-topping 45 TFSI breaks the 6.5s barrier at 6.3s to 60mph. All other engines are slower.
A1 can be had with 3 different engines, and the fastest one does 0-60 in 7.7s.
Really, the only Audi where <6.5s to 60mph is "standard" is the A8, with the slowest engine being the 50 TDI that does 0-60 in 5.9s. The second model in line, the A7, starts with a 40TDI that does 0-60 in 8.3 seconds.
Not too surprising. According to [1], the A3 and A4 mostly have 0-60 times worse than 6.5s. You've got to get up to the recent A6's to beat that.
[1]: https://www.zeroto60times.com/vehicle-make/audi-0-60-mph-tim...
It's also going to have truly awful front and rear visibility. Long windshields are invariably difficult to live with, creating a hothouse interior on any day without clouds. Once you add appendages to make this legal (side mirrors, rear center brake and tail lights, headlights and turn signals) much of the bold charm of the original concept truck (which is all this is) will be lost.
I agree the design is refreshingly bold. But lots of concept cars in the past initially took fans by storm only to fade into the mainstream by the time they shipped. I'll be very impressed if a design this striking can maintain its visual impact all the way through production.
(also, honestly this design is a fugly tin can. Elon musk is generally going through a tin can phase (starship etc)). I wouldn't bet on many sales for this, but it's still interesting to see something so different
That said, it is a truck, and maybe someone (perhaps even Tesla) will develop a modular LNG/propane/diesel generator unit you can put into the back of the truck for purposes of range extension. I realize this is inefficient, not environmentally friendly, and going in the opposite direction of what the electric car is supposed to do, but its also only applicable in those extreme edge cases where you need to be away from the grid for days or weeks.
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Yeah I don’t think so. Trucks are not suburban status items. This is more like the El Camino of 2022.
Have you ever been to Texas?
I have found the single stupidest thing in this thread.
Frankly, I don't think will cannibalize the existing P/U market as much as it will sway more people away from SUVs into [Cyber]trucks, especially if the back seat is as spacious as a normal full size truck's.
The only thing the Cybertruck needs is more colors. It's a little odd looking, like Robocop is coming to town, but it's time for changes in the market. The Model 3 converted me to viewing existing cars as dinosaurs, and this will probably transform the truck market as well.
I grew up working on a farm, and while I'm a developer today, I still get my hands dirty. I'm in for one.
It's only a "long bed" when you compare it to midsize trucks like the Tacoma or Ridgeline, which is what this vehicle really is more akin to (especially the first generation Ridgeline, as you can't replace the bed on the Cybertruck or the old Ridgeline as it was a part of the unibody - not good when you accidentally overload or bend up the bed, unfortunately).
Curious to see what the production version ends up like, but I don't know if this is really going to be taken seriously by people who need a "real" truck, at least in the current form. It's more of a weekend warrior vehicle right now, I'd say
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crash_incompatibility
Looks sweet though.
But you can be super safe while still helping protect your crash partners. You can often improve both your and your crash partner's safety with more crumple zones.
I don't think the patrons of this thing are going to be thinking about this much.